anyone know's octo/david's new hp number?

[Fuzz]

wow... I almost wanted to get my 1st tank from him... but at that time, my wi-fe says no... cos we do not know this guy... thank God I listen to my wi-fe... that was in Dec last yr... I could very well be the victim!!!

[loupgarou]

Your report has been forwarded to the following police unit for follow-up:

Police Unit : Clementi Police Division HQ

Investigation Officer In-charge : Ng Swee Eng

An official copy of your report is attached below. Please quote this report no.

D/20041109/0001e for future reference. You may wish to print a copy of the

report for your retention.

---

ok: if you guys are also interested parties with a claim, feel free to file your report as well, quoting my case reference number.

you can file report online at www.spf.gov.sg

[Reefaholic]

wow... I almost wanted to get my 1st tank from him... but at that time, my wi-fe says no... cos we do not know this guy... thank God I listen to my wi-fe... that was in Dec last yr... I could very well be the victim!!!

sometimes is good to listen to wife. they got 6th senses.

[dersuz]

woah... lucky I never order my cabinet and hood from him.. was planning to as he offered me b4... heng ah... tt time I already heard abt bro dersuz's case with him liao.. so was a bit skeptical.. but he seemed to have made it seem like a misunderstanding.. now we know...

I think you got the wrong person cause I did not order any tank from him.

[ryz]

oh.. yea.. dragttg or something.. sorry for mistaken identity

[Maxima]

interesting, there's more history to be told? can someone let me know any track history or the relevant threads.

My 2 cents, go to Aquamart ....David build all of Aquamart customer's tank and alos maintenance. This is what I as told.

I believe Aquamart still there right??

They might be able to help

[dradttg]

Hi all,

I think i need to clarify with you some pts since pple are assuming I am DAvid's partner.

Sad to say, David had disappear for months. Including some money I given him to pay the supplier. Therefore, I dun really enjoy the limelight given to me since I am one of the victims.

From what I know from CAD officers, u ordered your tank in Jan or Feb I believe. During that period of time, david did not have a registered company at all & all the info he give on the reciept is fake.

I was later tricked to register Xtreme Aquatic company & he will come in later. However, this did not happen.

CAD did contacted me & investigate found me innocent as it is David & yr transaction. Way before I register my Company.

By Law, David is never my partner before.

Cheers!

Wei

Dear Partner (not by Law) turned Victim Wei,

I am sorry but I do not feel any sympathy for you.

Let's go back to back to Mar when the whole incident started.

1) When David introduced you to me in my house, IN-FRONT of you as his partner. You never deny nor dispute him. When he posted this, I dont not see you denying/disputing too.

2) In Mar, you are the one posting and shouting the loudest about why the supplier (sponsor XGlare) should keep my $1100 as I have sabo him (even though the light was not delivered 2 months after I have made full payment). I have verified with Gary that David had only paid him deposit and the deposit was returned in FULL to David upon the cancellation.

3) You are well aware that David has pocketed my $1100 and yet you still registered Xtreme Aquatics. You even tell the CAD officer that you have already informed me in advance that your company will only be registered after the Chinese New Year and is only doing the tank for me earlier as a favor. All this is bullsh**, unless you are trying to tell me that you are also doing Ta*g*, Terr******, Tiger***, B**z, etc a favor.

Since you claimed that you are also a victim, what legal actions have you taken/going to take against David? You know that as the owner of Xtreme Aquatics, all the legal actions taken will be against you.

[seareefer]

Why nobody try the newspaper.

[dradttg]

Your report has been forwarded to the following police unit for follow-up:

Police Unit : Clementi Police Division HQ

Investigation Officer In-charge : Ng Swee Eng

An official copy of your report is attached below. Please quote this report no.

D/20041109/0001e for future reference. You may wish to print a copy of the

report for your retention.

---

ok: if you guys are also interested parties with a claim, feel free to file your report as well, quoting my case reference number.

you can file report online at www.spf.gov.sg

Hi loupgarou,

You did your report online?? I went down to the police station personally and was told by the constable that the case is classified as fraud but no action will be taken as it is a civil case.

The only party that is taking action is the CAD. They however will only fine David for operating an illegal company but will not be responsible for getting back the money. Maybe if more people report, they will take more concrete action.

My report no. at CAD is A/20040322/0101D and the officer following my case is Tay Leng Siong.

[Wei]

Dear Dradttg,

1) When David introduced you to me in my house, IN-FRONT of you as his partner. You never deny nor dispute him. When he posted this, I dont not see you denying/disputing too.

When I first went to yr place, thats when we(David & me) decide to work together. Thats months after u ordered yr tanks & equipments from David & I am still his tank supplier.

I only know u when David bring me to yr place when he send dwn the equipments u purchase from him.

Therefore, why should I deny when he mention at that time??

2) In Mar, you are the one posting and shouting the loudest about why the supplier (sponsor XGlare) should keep my $1100 as I have sabo him (even though the light was not delivered 2 months after I have made full payment). I have verified with Gary that David had only paid him deposit and the deposit was returned in FULL to David upon the cancellation.

from my understanding, during the period of 2 mths, u got the assurance from X-Glare personally that the light is coming but delayed due to stop over at some other ports.

u only decide to cancel the order of the light set after David told u it is at Changi Airport already waiting to be cleared.

Isn't it obvious to me as a third party then that u did that purposely?

I believe the CAD Officer mention to u clearly. The transaction is between u & David, I play no part in it/ even taken a cent. I only come into the picture becos I register Xtreme Aquatics as a company in Late March.

3) You are well aware that David has pocketed my $1100 and yet you still registered Xtreme Aquatics. You even tell the CAD officer that you have already informed me in advance that your company will only be registered after the Chinese New Year and is only doing the tank for me earlier as a favor. All this is bullsh**, unless you are trying to tell me that you are also doing Ta*g*, Terr******, Tiger***, B**z, etc a favor.

Did I inform u personally that I am doing a favor for u??? Pls chk with CAD Officer again.

I only first seen u when David brought me to yr place.

I register Xtreme Aquatics at the pt of time even after I know yr issue with David becos

1)he assure me that he will settle with u in small claim court (Which he did not do so!)

2)register first & he will join in the company later. (Which he did not do so!)

From the CAD Officer, u know clearly that David is operating an illegal company during yr transaction with him.

I am totally not involved!

Since you claimed that you are also a victim, what legal actions have you taken/going to take against David?

I am now trying to trace any customers ordering from David bearing "Xtreme Aquatic" company name from 20 May 2004 till CURRENT DATE. Legal actions will be taken if he is involved in illegally using of the company name.

Transactions before 28th March 2004 is not included as I am not involved in any of the transactions & illegal company that David is running.

You know that as the owner of Xtreme Aquatics, all the legal actions taken will be against you.

If thats the case, I will just see u in court & proof my innocent.

Some of my customers are here in SRC too. Why are they not complaining??

I am running a legitimate business with registered company & fulifiling all my orders & transactions.

I do not know yr true intention besides getting yr revenge from David. But I will not hesitate in taking any legal actions against anyone trying to damage me/ my company.

Records of all related threads will be recorded as reference for any legal actions to be taken in future if needed.

Cheers!

Wei

[Tanggy]

Hi all, sorry to hear all these unhappy things have happened. Have been inactive for long time. I met David a few weeks ago, had learned that a close member is very sick and he has been very busy and has been inactiver in his trade for months.

I really hope all these issues can be resolved as I can sympathise with the stress and unhappiness you guys are going through. Hopefully this is all a huge misunderstanding as this is after a hobby to be enjoyed.

[dradttg]

Dear Wei,

When I first went to yr place, thats when we(David & me) decide to work together. Thats months after u ordered yr tanks & equipments from David & I am still his tank supplier.

I only know u when David bring me to yr place when he send dwn the equipments u purchase from him.

Therefore, why should I deny when he mention at that time??

>> Scratch head << Partner...not partner...nevermind...too complicated.

from my understanding, during the period of 2 mths, u got the assurance from X-Glare personally that the light is coming but delayed due to stop over at some other ports.

u only decide to cancel the order of the light set after David told u it is at Changi Airport already waiting to be cleared.

Isn't it obvious to me as a third party then that u did that purposely?

In your opinion, why would I want to pay in full and play him out? >> again I scratch head <<

The only reason why I am cancelling is because I had to chase XGlare myself because David is simply not interested/anxious.

Btw, I had agreed to take the light but David neither deliver nor return my money.

Did I inform u personally that I am doing a favor for u??? Pls chk with CAD Officer again.

I most surely will do that.

If thats the case, I will just see u in court & proof my innocent.

Well...why would you want to see me in court? I am only stating facts that you have already confirmed yourself.

The one you should be seeing in court is the one who took your money meant for suppliers and is spoliting the company name by taking money from customers.

I do not know yr true intention besides getting yr revenge from David. But I will not hesitate in taking any legal actions against anyone trying to damage me/ my company.

Well, I am a victim that has been called an unreasonable customer and liar. I am also trying to proof my innocent. Again, why are you threatening to sue me when I am just stating facts.

Anyway, all these talks is a waste of time so I shall not comment anymore as I have better things to do.

I just hope that there is sufficient awareness raised here that the Mar 04 incident will not be repeated again in Mar 05.

[Wei]

Dear dradttg,

end of the day, the light issue is between u & David. I believe the CAD Officer had told u I got nothing to do with it or taken a cent.

I am only dragged in cos I registered the Company at a later date. I would not have been involved in the first place if I just name my company as another name.

Loupgarou & I had met months ago after David disappearance. I am the one that update him ways of contacting David. Infact, loupgarou post his reply looking for David after we exchange some pms hrs before only. He posted because theres no other channels to contact him.

By Loupgarou

ok: just to clarify wei's position, yes, he was the one who gave me his new contact number and is innocent in all these matters.

The one you should be seeing in court is the one who took your money meant for suppliers and is spoliting the company name by taking money from customers.

THanks for highlighting that. So pls try not to make it like I CHEATED YRS/ ANYONEs' MONEY, BUT THE FACT IS I DID NOT!!!

As for u... The one you should be seeing in court is the one who took your money meant for the lights and makes pple think that u are an unreasonable customer and liar.

Hi all, sorry to hear all these unhappy things have happened. Have been inactive for long time. I met David a few weeks ago, had learned that a close member is very sick and he has been very busy and has been inactiver in his trade for months.

I really hope all these issues can be resolved as I can sympathise with the stress and unhappiness you guys are going through. Hopefully this is all a huge misunderstanding as this is after a hobby to be enjoyed.

I believe all this issue would not have arise if he is to update his customers personally. I hope he come out & resolve all the outstanding issues fast.

Wei

[DeepBlue]

At this point, llike to urge everyone to take a step back and relook at what is being posted here. Think fellow reefers are now more aware of certain issues regarding a FEW purchases and sales that had gone wrong.

I do not think arguing online at this point is going to help solve things. Best thing is for whoever party involved to settle it outside the forum.

The thread has served its function of highlighting the problems encountered. Think reefers who has more info can pm the respective parties directly instead of making the thread look like a verbal war.

Hope you guys can solve this soon. All the best.

[RAV-65]

I remember the last time a lengthy thread by Dradttg complaining about David absconding with his $$$, there was a reefer who went to all lengths to speak up for David, trying to win some votes for David while our poor Dradttg was treated as some kind of whiner.... despite being the aggrieved party!!

Now that more cases have surfaced this time round to further plunge the nails into David's character, this reefer has yet again appeared out of nowhere ( after being away for a period of time ) to once again speak for David, hoping to shower some hope over David...

I really wonder why....

Compassion aside, should anyone care if Huang Na's killer Mr Took's father is sick? Should the killer be given more space to breathe juz becoz a family member is ill or should the law come full force on him?

Juz my $0.02....

[typrobin]

it has more or less been proven that this octo/david fella is a cr**k..

it reminds me of another guy who cheated my $1k a few years back..

i filed a police report, went to small claim tribunal and there is nothing i can do cos he was declared bankrupt...the worst thing is tat the cops cannot do anything even though it is obvious that he cheated my money...the reason being the method he used to cheat me was termed as a business fraud, thus the only thing i can do is sue him...

at times, i wonder wat the cops do...only catch rapist and murderers?? tat guy is obviously a ch**t, just like those magic-stone ch##ts...

Edited November 11, 2004 by DeepBlue

[DeepBlue]

Guys....to save yourself from getting into any legal issues, please refrain from adding to the thread and resort to name-calling or accusations if we do not have the full picture of the story.

I have edited a couple of posts and like to remind everyone to keep to the objective and intent of this post.

Hope this can be sorted out soon and somehow you all can get in contact with David and resolve this.

[loupgarou]

can the moderator please remove any reference to ##### (as well as this post), it has nothing to do with him and he's pretty much one of the victims as well.

I suggest everyone who has an interest in this to file a police report, collectively, it would add to the evidence (proponderance of) that this david thing isn't a misunderstanding, but a concerted effort to defraud people

Edited November 11, 2004 by DeepBlue

[loupgarou]

as far as the CAD is involved, I think they are wrong to say it is a CIVIL matter, I will certainly clarify this with them if they insist. in the penal code, its clearly a felony.

last but not least, the problem here is david and not xtreme aquatic, my receipt from david was a blank no company name one. because the company was not incorporated at the time of the fraud, the current company as a legal entity is not liable as well.

the penal code (and thus a criminal and not a civil offence states)

Cheating.

415. Whoever, by deceiving any person, fraudulently or dishonestly induces the person so deceived to deliver any property to any person, or to consent that any person shall retain any property, or intentionally induces the person so deceived to do or omit to do anything which he would not do or omit if he were not so deceived, and which act or omission causes or is likely to cause damage or harm to that person in body, mind, reputation or property, is said to “cheat”.

Explanation 1.

A dishonest concealment of facts is a deception within the meaning of this section.

Explanation 2.

Mere breach of contract is not of itself proof of an original fraudulent intent.

Illustrations

(a) A, by falsely pretending to be in the Government service, intentionally deceives Z, and thus dishonestly induces Z to let him have on credit goods for which he does not mean to pay. A cheats.

( ...

(h) A intentionally deceives Z into a belief that A has performed A’s part of a contract made with Z, which he has not performed, and thereby dishonestly induces Z to pay money. A cheats.

(duh like repairing and returning the tank)

...

Cheating by personation.

416. A person is said to “cheat by personation”, if he cheats by pretending to be some other person, or by knowingly substituting one person for another, or representing that he or any other person is a person other than he or such other person really is.

Explanation.

The offence is committed whether the individual personated is a real or imaginary person.

Illustrations

(a) A cheats by pretending to be a certain rich banker of the same name. A cheats by personation.

( A cheats by pretending to be B, a person who is deceased. A cheats by personation.

Punishment for cheating.

417. Whoever cheats shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to one year, or with fine, or with both.

Criminal breach of trust.

405. Whoever, being in any manner entrusted with property, or with any dominion over property, dishonestly misappropriates or converts to his own use that property, or dishonestly uses or disposes of that property in violation of any direction of law prescribing the mode in which such trust is to be discharged, or of any legal contract, express or implied, which he has made touching the discharge of such trust, or wilfully suffers any other person to do so, commits “criminal breach of trust”.

Stolen property.

410. —(1) Property the possession whereof has been transferred by theft, or by extortion, or by robbery, and property which has been criminally misappropriated, or in respect of which criminal breach of trust or cheating has been committed, is designated as “stolen property”, whether the transfer has been made or the misappropriation or breach of trust or cheating has been committed within or without Singapore. But if such property subsequently comes into the possession of a person legally entitled to the possession thereof, it then ceases to be stolen property.

(2) The expression “stolen property” includes any property into or for which stolen property has been converted or exchanged and anything acquired by such conversion or exchange, whether immediately or otherwise.

----

so we got him on fraudulently representing a company officer, cheating, CBT, possession and then disposal of stolen property (my tank).

---

in anycase, I found out my tank was destroyed by the glass maker two months after david absconded with the glass maker's money, but is the glass maker liable? no. just david.

[RAV-65]

Something pops to my mind, there are so many members here in SRC, my guess is that surely there's someone who has already informed David of the presence of this thread, and yet he doesn't appear, is he simply ignoring all these development in some sort of self-belief that the law cannot catch up with him, after all, he has already effectively evaded the law on several occasions!

I tink it's pretty obvious of the blatant disregard he has for other people's money and also the Law...

By changing a so-called phone number for "business operations" is indeed his intention and tactic to abscond with the money??

Good luck to all those who have lost money to him, I get this strong feeling that he'll never appear, I might be wrong, but I can't see him appearing and returning all the $$$, at best, he would appear and start trying to argue his way through again....

[loupgarou]

I don't know, but at least some things can be done to punish the guy.

a) bankruptcy,

garnish his income

c) write of seizure

d) jail time.

all of which would ensure a subsistence style living for this fella even if cpf board will not allow us to sell his flat (cos its probably his parents anyway)

[terryansimon]

uh-oh.

gee I hope all this can be resolved ASAP.

it's queer how I never got such screw ups.

[loupgarou]

dear folks, david called me today, said he was away in bangkok with the phone off and just got back. was notified of this issue by his existing customers.

I have the details of his particulars and the current handphone number, if you need to contact him to see about your delivery/etc please contact his nick octo, if no response, let me know and I'll pass you the hp number as well.

in otherwords, I consider my issue with him settled until Jan 10 or so when I expect a delivery of my tank.

I've already sent a mail to the officer in charge to close/settle the case for now as such I cannot be party to any outstanding claims anyone else has against him but now that he has surfaced, perhaps you can settle your case against him.

[Johncraze]

Hi Loupgarou,

I got sms from David on 11/11/04 too. He said he will update me but did not indicate when. I am also a victim. I would like to know more about how you too get cheated. If you don't mind to share with me, I like to call you.

Thank You.

JohnC

[Wei]

Hi Johncraze,

as what we have communicated over the phone, I think the most important thing to do now is to get yr money back from David.

Even the receipt is not valid as he does not represent the company at all.

See if Chris can help u get the number & give u a better picture of the whole thing.

Wei