Angel fish

[Asfur]

Angelfishes are my favorites, they're simply beautiful, lovely, colorful, elegant yet also among the most demanding in terms of food and water quality. My favorite among all angels is the blue-face angel. If you have seen a fully grown blue-face angel with all its adult coloration, I'm sure you'll agree. I have one in my old tank which has been there for a year. I'm still looking forward to buy another blue-face angel for my new 6-months old tank but this fish's quite rare here.

My second favorite angelfish is the regal angelfish, but I still haven't had much success in keeping it (have tried twice). They're just dying due to starvation. They didn't want to eat any food that I offered (nori, pellets, and lettuces). So how do you feed your regal angel and keep it alive?

Hi twrs, Blue-Face or here we (indonesian) call Napoleon Angelfish is absolutely very common here, i am very weird why you said it is rare.

About your failure with regal angelfish, i think you pick the wrong species, or may be you don't know how to persue thw regal to eat, cos' at the first time, regal is a fuzzy eater, but when he settle in your tank, he will give you with good performance and eat what ever you offer, mine eat pellet, lettuce, shrimps, squids, scallops, flakes, even Lou Han pellets.

[Asfur]

Wah liew... see all the Angels really make me "gian"!!! I love angels, but so far only got Flame and Emperor Juv in my tank.... Lost 4 beautiful Golden Angels ( they're too damn hard to keep! ) ....

Just bought a Potter Angel yesterday!!!

Vincent Ho

Hi RAV-65, from what i read in many thread and saw some failure here in my country, golden pigmy angel is not an easy fish to keep, it most die in starvation (same case with Multi Barred Angelfish/Paracentropyge Multifasciatus), and even your golden can live, it will hide forever behind your decoration. There is one LFS that can keep golden for more than a year, and yes when i try to look at the fish is very hard cos' it hide.

Potter's is a better choice.

[Asfur]

wts684, looking at your tank, if im not wrong you're not using a sump filtation aren't you? Are you using eheim filtration? If that's true, hope you use a big eheim capacity, cos if not then your ehiem will not give good filtration capacity. And looking at your condition, i think most of your soft coral and hard coral will not live longer, it will die either eat by your fish or cos' too high DOC in your water. Also i don't think your Polkadot Sweetlips will live longer, this will will also die cos' of starvation. This story is just to share to you, you might like it or not, but i just try to tell the truth.

[neokn]

Asfur,

It seems like you know Angels pretty well. Can you advise on how you angels persue your angel to eat those food that you feed? Need urgent advise as I have a Coral beauty in my tank which wasn't eating for the past 3 days and further more it have isolated itself from the rest of the pack. I notice ICH on it too now. Fish was introduce to the tank 5 days ago, it was nibbling on my LR on the first 2 days but after that it stops.

Now it is not just the fish is stressed, I'm too.

[Asfur]

Asfur,

It seems like you know Angels pretty well. Can you advise on how you angels persue your angel to eat those food that you feed? Need urgent advise as I have a Coral beauty in my tank which wasn't eating for the past 3 days and further more it have isolated itself from the rest of the pack. I notice ICH on it too now. Fish was introduce to the tank 5 days ago, it was nibbling on my LR on the first 2 days but after that it stops.

Now it is not just the fish is stressed, I'm too.

Hi, one thing for sure, i'm not an expert, i'm just dedicating my last 5 years (from 10 years) in FOWLR and angelfish as my favourite fish. And i do so many search in the net about angelfish through RC, Reef.Org, SGREEF, and many more, just to read and gain knowledge and hopefully share with people that need info. So the information that i give above is mostly venture by advance hobbist either in RC or Reef.Org that may be you guys not yet read. So this is actually not new info, and i bet achilles tank also know what i write here.

To courage fish to eat from your hand then you must teach your fish, it just a matter time for your fish to know that "your hand" is not an enemy for them, then after they know it, your fish will go up everytime you feed your fish.

About your coral beauty, i have my own perception, most thread and fish info said that this fish is easy keep and some of though pigmy angel, but here in indonesia, i found contrary case, actually coral beauty is a 50-50 or 60-40 or even worst 70-30 failure. So for your case, i think you better try open scallops, crush crab claw, or slice squid, and try in seperate tank, coral beauty is not as bold as big angel.

All of this is IMHO.

[Godzilla]

Hmmm, your regal is in red alert, i don't think he will live for more than a year or even worse half a year, i don't mean to discourage you, but since you pick the wrong species, i don't think you will succeed with that regal. My species and Regal species is the correct regal that can be keep in the tank. And also your one month old tank is surely not mature enough to hold too many fish especially angel, cos' angel need more mature water parameter.

think i totally agree with u bro... i believe the yellow belly regal is more suitable for the home aquarium.

anywa, gd luck to bro WTS684..hope u r sucessful in keeping these beautiful angels

[RAV-65]

Hi RAV-65, from what i read in many thread and saw some failure here in my country, golden pigmy angel is not an easy fish to keep, it most die in starvation (same case with Multi Barred Angelfish/Paracentropyge Multifasciatus), and even your golden can live, it will hide forever behind your decoration. There is one LFS that can keep golden for more than a year, and yes when i try to look at the fish is very hard cos' it hide.

Potter's is a better choice.

Bro,

totally agree with you, the Golden angel is very hard to keep, mainly due to its diet... for me, I kept 4 before, the 1st one survived 3-4 weeks but died of starvation, the 2nd and 3rd died after they keep knocking into the beta-box I kept them in , the lip like torn, I understand its becoz they are a very timid fish and they keep knocking into the beta-box as they are scared, and hoping to "escape". The 4th one was probably a bad fish, coz it died the next day when I brought it home... tink it was overstressed at the LFS as it was kept in a small container...

So decided to get the Potter Angel! And he has started eating!! Still in my beta box though, will release him tomolo if he eats again tonight, I wan to be very certain that it can regconise food...

Vincent Ho

[RAV-65]

Asfur,

It seems like you know Angels pretty well. Can you advise on how you angels persue your angel to eat those food that you feed? Need urgent advise as I have a Coral beauty in my tank which wasn't eating for the past 3 days and further more it have isolated itself from the rest of the pack. I notice ICH on it too now. Fish was introduce to the tank 5 days ago, it was nibbling on my LR on the first 2 days but after that it stops.

Now it is not just the fish is stressed, I'm too.

Bro, pls make sure there are no other fishes bullying it... although Coral Beauties are pretty aggressive fishes, they may be very timid when 1st introduced... if there are other fishes bullying it, it will hide... which is why its isolated.

Also, how are your water parameters? Are they okay??

The ich probably due to stress... as the CB is a pretty hardy fish...

Juz my $0.02....

Vincent Ho

[wts684]

wts684, looking at your tank, if im not wrong you're not using a sump filtation aren't you? Are you using eheim filtration? If that's true, hope you use a big eheim capacity, cos if not then your ehiem will not give good filtration capacity. And looking at your condition, i think most of your soft coral and hard coral will not live longer, it will die either eat by your fish or cos' too high DOC in your water. Also i don't think your Polkadot Sweetlips will live longer, this will will also die cos' of starvation. This story is just to share to you, you might like it or not, but i just try to tell the truth.

Dear Ashur,

What is the different b/n sump filtation & eheim filtration?

My tank equipment is as follow:

1 Sander Ozonier C50 with air pump

1 Red Sea Skimmer

1 Eheim proffesional II external filter

1 overflow system

1 Micro compact chiller

1 Rea Sea wavemasterpro with 4 power head

Pls advise what other else equipment u can recommend.

BTW, what is DOC. How to solve?

[RAV-65]

Dear Ashur,

What is the different b/n sump filtation & eheim filtration?

My tank equipment is as follow:

1 Sander Ozonier C50 with air pump

1 Red Sea Skimmer

1 Eheim proffesional II external filter

1 overflow system

1 Micro compact chiller

1 Rea Sea wavemasterpro with 4 power head

Pls advise what other else equipment u can recommend.

BTW, what is DOC. How to solve?

DOC is Dissolved Organic Compound i tink.... or something similar, basically, your ozoniser is a good peice of equipment as it helps to break down the nutrients better, hence helping your skimmer to do the job.

But one thing dat comes to mind is, wat are your parameters like? nh4, no2, no3, po4?? are they all pretty low? if they are not, I tink your setup is not effective enough, could be due to the bioload of the tank, or water flow... the skimmer etc etc... you have to understand whether ur setup is effective enough, is there enough sand, enough LR, enough current, skimmer skimming enough, u may not even need the ozoniser, but if your readings are not all zero or in the lower levels, den something must be still wrong somewhere....

If there are no agressors in your tank, it should be pretty easy to get your fishes to eat... but did u acclimatise them well??

Also, please make sure you got good testkits, if not you getting all the wrong readings!

Juz my 2 cts....

Vincent Ho

[neokn]

Well good news, my angel is eating already after I flood the tank with live BS and garlic essence frozen BS last night. Another good news is that I finally sold the "murder" in my tank to another reefer whom owns a 7' tank. I hope this can lighten the stress that my LS is getting. I'll try the flooding effect this morning again and post the result. I really hope that this angel can stay alive.

Anyway, thanks for all your advise.

[RAV-65]

Bro, suggest, u cut down on your feeding or u'll have other problems very soon... anyway, wat murderer u tokking about?

Vincent Ho

[Asfur]

Dear Ashur,

What is the different b/n sump filtation & eheim filtration?

My tank equipment is as follow:

1 Sander Ozonier C50 with air pump

1 Red Sea Skimmer

1 Eheim proffesional II external filter

1 overflow system

1 Micro compact chiller

1 Rea Sea wavemasterpro with 4 power head

Pls advise what other else equipment u can recommend.

BTW, what is DOC. How to solve?

Hi wts684, for briefly, both filter is do the same job between canister filter (eheim) and sump, they do mechanical and biological filtration, but sump filter is usually big so that the filter can hold and process the inhabitant by product better than canister filter, that just my 2 cents.

I don't have any experience with ozonizer, so i can't give comment here, although i read in many thread and books that ozonizer and UV steriliver is almost unusefull in marine tank.

Overall i think RAV-65 are giving a right info, so he already answer your question.

Your tank will content high DOC sooner or later cos' you keep big angel that will release big "pooh" and need eat protein (meat base food) and vegetable. So, you can imagine the by product from your big angel. That's why most reefer don't keep so many fish and only put small fish. IMHO

[Asfur]

Yup, agreed with RAV-65, unless you have a very good skimmer and a mature filter, then you will spike ammonia and can kill your fish.

[neokn]

Bro, suggest, u cut down on your feeding or u'll have other problems very soon... anyway, wat murderer u tokking about?

Vincent Ho

Roger on the flooding issue.

But I still have a juv. alatantic blue whom refuse to eat or was it eating but I didn't see it??????

Another good news, my angel seems to be recovering from ICH already as I see there are lesser white spot compare to yesterday. I guess my cleaner shrimp/ blood shrimp really did they job well. Also it have return to join the pack swimming around the LR.

Murderer - Blue Carpet Anemone

This damn anemone kill S$55/- of my LS till last night.

1 x hogfish (S$6), 1 x lavender tang(S$6), 1 x golden angel(S$32), 1x SH(S$5), 1 x butterfly(S$6)

Not to mention it stressed all my LS. But it wasn't to be blame cause I bought it w/o checking with the LFS what will it eat. One thing did surprise me too was that I was so damn big with the fan full open, it measures 8" in diameter.

[RAV-65]

Roger on the flooding issue.

But I still have a juv. alatantic blue whom refuse to eat or was it eating but I didn't see it??????

Another good news, my angel seems to be recovering from ICH already as I see there are lesser white spot compare to yesterday. I guess my cleaner shrimp/ blood shrimp really did they job well. Also it have return to join the pack swimming around the LR.

Murderer - Blue Carpet Anemone

This damn anemone kill S$55/- of my LS till last night.

1 x hogfish (S$6), 1 x lavender tang(S$6), 1 x golden angel(S$32), 1x SH(S$5), 1 x butterfly(S$6)

Not to mention it stressed all my LS. But it wasn't to be blame cause I bought it w/o checking with the LFS what will it eat. One thing did surprise me too was that I was so damn big with the fan full open, it measures 8" in diameter.

Bro,

dun underestimate the size og ur booming anemone... but if u ask me, unles its super hungry, it would eat all the fishes u mentioned, could there be other factors leading to the fish death? like poor acclimatisation or rpredator in your tank? ( big crabs? mantis? )

Thye fish could have been dead adn while floating around, it was picked up by the anemone! the truth is bat most of these fishes nwould stay away from the anemone adn i dun tink the anemone is at fault here...

Juz my 2 cts...

Vincent Ho

[neokn]

Most of the fish that the anemone ate, were stung in the night. So I would reckon that due to darkness and the anemone extended itself higher than usual in the night could the reason to their death.

All fish that was eaten were health eating fish but was sometime terrorised by 2 pioneer fish in my tank (yellow damsel and blue velvet damsel). I'm not sure about the whether is there a manis shrimp in my tank or not but I do know that there is a illegal immgrant (small crab) in my tank.

[madmac]

Bro,

totally agree with you, the Golden angel is very hard to keep, mainly due to its diet... for me, I kept 4 before, the 1st one survived 3-4 weeks but died of starvation, the 2nd and 3rd died after they keep knocking into the beta-box I kept them in , the lip like torn, I understand its becoz they are a very timid fish and they keep knocking into the beta-box as they are scared, and hoping to "escape". The 4th one was probably a bad fish, coz it died the next day when I brought it home... tink it was overstressed at the LFS as it was kept in a small container...

So decided to get the Potter Angel! And he has started eating!! Still in my beta box though, will release him tomolo if he eats again tonight, I wan to be very certain that it can regconise food...

Vincent Ho

Rav,

Hi how's the Potter Angel doing?

Have you released it into the main tank?

Saw a few for sale at PasirRis, can I ask how much you paid for her?

& Finally, I noticed that you also have a flame angel, are the two d. angels getting along fine?

I am intending on a Potter, but I'm not too sure as to whether it'll go well with an existing Golden Pygmy in a 3' setup. The Potter's a real sweetie!

TIA,

mm

[RAV-65]

Rav,

Hi how's the Potter Angel doing?

Have you released it into the main tank?

Saw a few for sale at PasirRis, can I ask how much you paid for her?

& Finally, I noticed that you also have a flame angel, are the two d. angels getting along fine?

I am intending on a Potter, but I'm not too sure as to whether it'll go well with an existing Golden Pygmy in a 3' setup. The Potter's a real sweetie!

TIA,

mm

Bro,

the Flame Angel and my Emperor Juv. is doing fine, eating well and real stable.... the Potter was released yesterday. and it seems to be doing well, already eating, but can tell its still getting of the new environment...

Anyway, bought the Potter at $32...

U got a golden?! Awwww.... dat's my favourite Angel! but have problem keeping it! Anyway, the Golden is a very timid fish, it should have no prob getting along with ur Potter is u r getting one...

Vincent Ho

[RAV-65]

madmac,

lastest news: juz saw my Potter Angel ( slightly bigger than my Flame Angel ) bullying my Flame Angel! I tink my Flame is pretty gentle coz when I introduced my Emperor Juv, it didn't bully it when the emperor was much smaller than it!

Vincent Ho

[madmac]

madmac,

lastest news: juz saw my Potter Angel ( slightly bigger than my Flame Angel ) bullying my Flame Angel! I tink my Flame is pretty gentle coz when I introduced my Emperor Juv, it didn't bully it when the emperor was much smaller than it!

Vincent Ho

Well at least you have acclimatized her well... maybe too well : )

When you say that its eating, do you mean you hand fed her or she's just eating off the LRs? 'Cause my goldie's not taken any food since I aquired her, its a little nerve wreaking... 1 month since, and counting.

Well gd luck anyway and happy keeping.

mm

[RAV-65]

Nah, hand-feeding would take time to coach! But its eating the foods dat I'm dropping into the water... anyway, about your Golden Angel, it's hard to get it to eat as it has a very unique diet like sponge.... So if u can train it to eat BS, den u have a good chance of keeping it well, if not, it might juz die of starvation....

Is the fish hiding alot?

Vincent Ho

[madmac]

Nah, hand-feeding would take time to coach! But its eating the foods dat I'm dropping into the water... anyway, about your Golden Angel, it's hard to get it to eat as it has a very unique diet like sponge.... So if u can train it to eat BS, den u have a good chance of keeping it well, if not, it might juz die of starvation....

Is the fish hiding alot?

Vincent Ho

Yes, initially for the 1st week or so.... nowadays, its not difficult to see her, I'd say that one can spot her about 70% of the time, just around rocks, pecking at them... trouble is if you go too close suddenly, she darts away into hiding.

Yesterday, I noticed she's starting to peck at algae growing on the back glass. Don't know how to train her at this stage as she's still pretty shy around ppl. You're caught with such shy fishes as if you underfeed, then the other fishes get to the food first-- overfeed....! Training is easiser with a newer one. Which leads me to my next question on your Potter as I am considering getting one.

1) How long did you keep the Potter Angel before releasing into the main tank?

2) Shy around people? Is it still agressive towards other fishes?

3) BS is live, frozen, or baby (as in live ones right)? How about freeze-dried for convinence? Any brand preference for such small fish?

TIA

mm

[RAV-65]

Most of the fish that the anemone ate, were stung in the night. So I would reckon that due to darkness and the anemone extended itself higher than usual in the night could the reason to their death.

All fish that was eaten were health eating fish but was sometime terrorised by 2 pioneer fish in my tank (yellow damsel and blue velvet damsel). I'm not sure about the whether is there a manis shrimp in my tank or not but I do know that there is a illegal immgrant (small crab) in my tank.

Bro,

u'll be surprised to know dat in the darkness, although we cant see anything, the fishes will still see an anemone! There maybe other factors leading to the fish's death.... I still tink the anemone is innocent!

Innocent until proven guilty!

Vincent Ho

[RAV-65]

Yes, initially for the 1st week or so.... nowadays, its not difficult to see her, I'd say that one can spot her about 70% of the time, just around rocks, pecking at them... trouble is if you go too close suddenly, she darts away into hiding.

Yesterday, I noticed she's starting to peck at algae growing on the back glass. Don't know how to train her at this stage as she's still pretty shy around ppl. You're caught with such shy fishes as if you underfeed, then the other fishes get to the food first-- overfeed....! Training is easiser with a newer one. Which leads me to my next question on your Potter as I am considering getting one.

1) How long did you keep the Potter Angel before releasing into the main tank?

2) Shy around people? Is it still agressive towards other fishes?

3) BS is live, frozen, or baby (as in live ones right)? How about freeze-dried for convinence? Any brand preference for such small fish?

TIA

mm

Bro,

the best word to describe a Golden angel is 'Timid', its an extremely timid fish and so far I've only heard about one case whereby the fish swims around bravely with the rest of the fishes and is not fearful of humans...

Anyway, to keep the fish away from the maintank by using a Beta is to train the fish to eat, at the same time, in a beta box, the new fish is able to see the rest of the occupants in the tank and get familiarised.

As long as the fish refuses to eat, I guess u have to keep it in the beta, if not, its not gonna have much chance learning to compete with the other occupants in the tank for food....

IMO, the Potter I have is pretty aggressive as it bullys my Flame angel who has been in the tank for more than 3 months liao... but den again, it may be only MY Potter is fierce! kekeke.... after all, its my first Potter!

BS refers to brine shrimp, I tink its better live or frozen, but dunno any statistics or info to prove it! I juz get the feeling dried food not as good! but i maybe wrong!

Juz my $0.02...

Vincent Ho