lizard44 Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 hi all, i am new to reefing. as a newbie, i have made many mistakes. some were due to lack of understanding; but, most were due to impatience. this thread is therefore dedicated to those lovely creatures who have died. i hope you all could add to this thread: to prevent further deaths caused by lack of informed advice. newbie lizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizard44 Posted January 16, 2005 Author Share Posted January 16, 2005 cleaner shrimp x2 mandarin x1 yellow goby x1 i bought 1x cleaner shrimp, 1x mandarin and 1x yellow goby from a LFS. the LFS packed all of them together. by the time i am back (2 hours later), all have UP-LORRY even before i open the packing. i went back the next day, the kind LFS gave me discount for another batch of the same LS. another time, i again bought 2x damsels and 1x cleaner wrasse all packed together by the LFS. reached home about 1 hour later, the cleaner wrasse almost UP-LORRY (luckily saved by simple air bubbling). i have since concluded that ... lesson learnt: never pack LS together and must go home fast. the second cleaner shrimp was acclimatised by adding water (50% one time) from the tank to the plastic bag. the cleaner shrimp again UP-LORRY. it took me almost 1 week before plucking the courage to try cleaner shrimp again. i bought one first. this time, i used a bottle cap to add water from the tank to the plastic bag. i only add water again when the cleaner shrimp is running around the bag. i did this until the entire water in the bag is increased by 3 times. i then released it into the tank. it has survived since then. i since have also added another cleaner shrimp with the same happy result. i have since concluded that ... lesson learnt: prawns are very VERY sensitive, contrary to what most reefers said about easy cleaner shrimps. newbie lizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member mUAr_cHEe Posted January 17, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 17, 2005 most noteable LFS will never pack all the LS together.... in fact... for all the LFS i go.... for me... even reborn... also pack each LS in a different packet... unless u buying clowns and damsels.... even still... clowns one pack and damsels another pack.... all crustaceans are sensative... crabs, prawns.... must acclimatise properly!!!!! with exception of 1 dollar turbo snails.... Quote *translated from Hokkien* "If say no bang wall, this idiot will never ripen" - Mr Quah Siew Kow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member Archilles19 Posted January 17, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 17, 2005 lizars44......the lesson to learn from Ur experience is.....never packed LS all in one bag......any LFS that do so is trying to be funny with U...........& one more thing.....does the phrase `ONCE BITTEN, TWICE SHY' mean anything to you......don go there again....if U need then be stern & tell them.....no....INSTRUCT them to packed the LS U purchase in separate bag... Like brudder MuarChee said about packing this type of fish in one bag & another type in the other...sooo.....U have to know which type of fish can be packed together & which can't.....& shrimp must always be packed separately take care Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member yiling Posted January 17, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 17, 2005 ya, though my LS did not die on my way home, they died because of my inexperience with water maintainence and baterial cycling. Just like all of you out there, i don't wish this to happened and hereby stopped buying anything and still waiting for my cycle to end. bless those fishy that died ..... Quote [ My Humble Home] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member mUAr_cHEe Posted January 17, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 17, 2005 lizars44......the lesson to learn from Ur experience is.....never packed LS all in one bag......any LFS that do so is trying to be funny with U...........& one more thing.....does the phrase `ONCE BITTEN, TWICE SHY' mean anything to you......don go there again....if U need then be stern & tell them.....no....INSTRUCT them to packed the LS U purchase in separate bag... Like brudder MuarChee said about packing this type of fish in one bag & another type in the other...sooo.....U have to know which type of fish can be packed together & which can't.....& shrimp must always be packed separately take care wonder if u buy lion fish... and some clowns..... all put one bag??? better still.... frog fish with lots of damsels in one bag.... LAGI BEST!!!! lion fish and scorpion fish...... all in one bag!!!!! Quote *translated from Hokkien* "If say no bang wall, this idiot will never ripen" - Mr Quah Siew Kow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member moxa Posted January 17, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 17, 2005 cleaner shrimp x2mandarin x1 yellow goby x1 i bought 1x cleaner shrimp, 1x mandarin and 1x yellow goby from a LFS. the LFS packed all of them together. by the time i am back (2 hours later), all have UP-LORRY even before i open the packing. i went back the next day, the kind LFS gave me discount for another batch of the same LS. another time, i again bought 2x damsels and 1x cleaner wrasse all packed together by the LFS. reached home about 1 hour later, the cleaner wrasse almost UP-LORRY (luckily saved by simple air bubbling). i have since concluded that ... lesson learnt: never pack LS together and must go home fast. the second cleaner shrimp was acclimatised by adding water (50% one time) from the tank to the plastic bag. the cleaner shrimp again UP-LORRY. it took me almost 1 week before plucking the courage to try cleaner shrimp again. i bought one first. this time, i used a bottle cap to add water from the tank to the plastic bag. i only add water again when the cleaner shrimp is running around the bag. i did this until the entire water in the bag is increased by 3 times. i then released it into the tank. it has survived since then. i since have also added another cleaner shrimp with the same happy result. i have since concluded that ... lesson learnt: prawns are very VERY sensitive, contrary to what most reefers said about easy cleaner shrimps. newbie lizard Hi, I can't help it. saw you mention mandarin. Hope yr tank have enough pods for the fellow. yup, always insist the LFS pack seperate bag of fishes for you. For proper acclimatisation you may refer to http://www.liveaquaria.com/general/general...=3319&subref=AI cheers Moxa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member tineng Posted January 17, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 17, 2005 another time, i again bought 2x damsels and 1x cleaner wrasse all packed together by the LFS. reached home about 1 hour later, the cleaner wrasse almost UP-LORRY (luckily saved by simple air bubbling). i have since concluded that ... agreed that you must go home fast, buy 1 hours and they up lorry??? including damels????? bro, you must really consisder your relationship with that LFS......imagine most fishes survive many many hours before reaching out shore.....just 1 hour in your bag and they up lorry???? something might be really wrong.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member yiling Posted January 17, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 17, 2005 agreed that you must go home fast, buy 1 hours and they up lorry??? including damels????? bro, you must really consisder your relationship with that LFS......imagine most fishes survive many many hours before reaching out shore.....just 1 hour in your bag and they up lorry???? something might be really wrong.... yea he got a point too....u might want to change buying from the LFS and see what happens... he's fishes might be fishy.. . Quote [ My Humble Home] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizard44 Posted January 17, 2005 Author Share Posted January 17, 2005 banana wrasse x1 (mia) thanks bro moxa i am coming to that. since the first mandarin died on the way. the kind LFS gave me a free mandarin as part of the new LS package. my tank is a 4-footer with life sand but only one 0.5 kg LR. so i bought a 2.5 kg LR for it. hey ... it worked. i got the formula right: mandarin x1 needs 3 kg LR to survive. i have since gotten 20 kg LR and 4 very happy mandarins. but my banana wrasse not so lucky. i acclimatised it well and the wrasse loves to hide in sand. it will disappear the whole day only to come out for a brief moment in the morning at 0900h. i tried to feed it with dried food and frozen b shrimps. the wrasse try to feed but badly. after 4 days of trying, the wrasse no longer appears. wondering why? lesson learnt: never buy ultra-flat tummy fish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member mUAr_cHEe Posted January 18, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 18, 2005 4 footer... 2 kg of LIFE ROCKS!?!?!?!?!? bro.... my first 2 footer.... also 4 KG of life rocks...... minus rocks that the corals come with it...... think u really need to do alot of reading.... try reading the pin ups in the top section of this sub forum.... Quote *translated from Hokkien* "If say no bang wall, this idiot will never ripen" - Mr Quah Siew Kow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member mUAr_cHEe Posted January 18, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 18, 2005 not discouraging u or flaming u...... juz offering advice.... maybe post a tank pic or u can look ard the member's forum to get a rough idea of how much LR to get.... Quote *translated from Hokkien* "If say no bang wall, this idiot will never ripen" - Mr Quah Siew Kow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizard44 Posted January 18, 2005 Author Share Posted January 18, 2005 yellow goby x1 hi bro muar_chee thanks for the kind words. i will try to get tank photo up once i get my camera back. it is now with a girl. wondering why she took so long to finish her photos. indeed i will continue ... the first yellow goby was UP-LORRY before i could do any-thing. the kind LFS then charged me cheap cheap for the next yellow goby x1. i itchy ... i bought another one with it. they are all 0.5 inch long. both stomaches were super flat (inexperience i guess). i try to feed them with dry and wet food, but they just don't bother. i even bought live food, but they still don't feed. after about 4 days, they started to feed on dry sinking food. now the problem starts ... one of the yellow gobies turned bright yellow in colour while the other turned light pale yellow. the bright yellow goby chased the pale yellow goby like hell, preventing the pale yellow from feeding. imagine 2 small fellow chasing across a blank 4-foot tank. quite a sight. 3 days later, pale yellow goby went UP-LORRY. the remaining goby is now quiet and feeding, but very lonely. lesson learnt: never buy same species? i might be giving up soon ... hahahahahaha newbie lizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member mUAr_cHEe Posted January 19, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 19, 2005 dun be discouraged yet.... you are just inexperienced at the moment.... do some reading... like i said.... then exercise paitence.... even after everything is set up.... cycle yr tank... for at least one month!! i cycled mine for like 2 to 3 months..... due to experience with previous tanks...... juz my 2 cents... Quote *translated from Hokkien* "If say no bang wall, this idiot will never ripen" - Mr Quah Siew Kow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member yiling Posted January 19, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 19, 2005 ya, don't be discouraged you need alot of patience... i believe bros and sis here have RIP alot of LS as well So hang on there Quote [ My Humble Home] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizard44 Posted January 19, 2005 Author Share Posted January 19, 2005 thanks yiling help, help, help ... my $40 flame angel not feeding for 4 days already. stomach grew from fat (at purchase) to super flat now. have been trying all kinds of food dry, wet, live, frozen, algae on stone, but to no avail. but my $6 coral beauty feeds like a pig. lesson learnt: price of stock is inversely proportional to survivability i just don't want to have another RIP. newbie lizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 lizard.. stop addin new fishes to ur tank n find out wat going wrong.... did u test ur water??? wat type of system n skimmer u use??? seem like only damsels never give u trouble rite???beta check before all ur fishes go to heaven.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAV-65 Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 thanks yiling help, help, help ... my $40 flame angel not feeding for 4 days already. stomach grew from fat (at purchase) to super flat now. have been trying all kinds of food dry, wet, live, frozen, algae on stone, but to no avail. but my $6 coral beauty feeds like a pig. lesson learnt: price of stock is inversely proportional to survivability i just don't want to have another RIP. newbie lizard I tink the best solution is to remove the coral beauty... The coral beauty, very much acclimatised in the tank is terrorising your Flame Angel, hence the Flame Angel dun dare to eat as the coral beauty is always in a frenzy during feeding... My $0.02... Quote People do not plan to fail; Often they just fail to plan... Wat I do to prevent myself from tearing my hair out... My stress remedy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizard44 Posted January 19, 2005 Author Share Posted January 19, 2005 thanks RAV since my early days of dying LS, i have adopted a 2-stage approach to intro LS. first, i will acclimatise my LS through dripping. second, i will put them in the refugium away from any fishes (flame angel being so silly expensive, is in this stage ) third, i will try to feed them in the refugium until they feed well before intro into the main graveyard for the survival of the fittest. in the graveyard, every damsel is killer when it comes to feeding. the flame angel being cheaper was dumped straight into the graveyard. so far this method has worked well for me (no deaths yet ). my tank now has 30 kg LR now (managed to buy some stinky ones at $5/kg), no lights (booked already from a LFS, but not coming until after chinese new year !!!) and no skimmer (no money, budget hobbyist) please suggest something to do to the flame angel (my special food to flame angel is $15 per bottle, big blood letting man... no more dole liao) newbie lizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member yiling Posted January 19, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 19, 2005 Hi lizard, just keep your poor fishy away....get a proper system running then intro them back to the tank. seems like u got alot of work to be done.... just a get a 10 skimmer if u really on budget.... And honestly, the 10 skimmer can only keep hardy fishes alive. If this goes on, i dont think your angel will survive too my 2 cents Quote [ My Humble Home] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzzz Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 hi lizard.. i think u had better remove ur fish from ur tank first... i presume the new LR u added in are uncured (as u said they r stinky) n may coz an ammonia spike due to the dieoff in the rocks which will in turn coz more death of ur fishes... like wat yiling had said, it's best to get a skimmer n oso monitor ur ammonia, no2 n no3 be4 u add in anymore new fishes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAV-65 Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 There have been success stories of tanks without skimmers... but that represent a small fraction of reef tanks and many often do not succeed without a skimmer... I suggest we do it the simple way rather than trying to beat the odds... Bro, a cheap skimmer can be bought for sometimes like $20 at the Pasar Malam thread (e.g weipro), with proper tuning, the weipro is so much better to have than to run a reef tank without a skimmer... Why not invest in one rather than to pay $15 for fish food when the fish might die of a no2 spike anytime?? The Flame angel maybe still in shock and it usually wun die within a few days even if it doesn't eat given a proper environment... Just keep the coral beauty away for the time being and maybe u could feed it with some cyclopeeze, most fishes ecept the bigger ones can't resist cyclopeeze... Quote People do not plan to fail; Often they just fail to plan... Wat I do to prevent myself from tearing my hair out... My stress remedy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizard44 Posted January 20, 2005 Author Share Posted January 20, 2005 blue damsel x1 thanks yiling and RAV cheong LFS today to get cyclopeeze lah ... bro wayne is maximum correct: my LR stinks for a day, now not so stinky liao. happy to report no LS deaths yet yes ... i wanted to buy skimmer, but first i heard many noisy stories and also too many types. i really don't know who to listen to. some are $1000+ some are $40. some even asked me not to have skimmer during the cycling .... wow of course i listen to the no-need-money option. actually that reminded me of my poor blue damsel ... i started with a small piece of LR 0.5 kg. because of a mandarin i added 2.5 kg LR. later, scare of not enough food for the mandarin, i added 4 more kg (because i have no lights, i can only try to buy food for the mandarin). that night, the qui lan blue damsel went UP LORRY. i never felt disappointed, because i have always wanted to catch this qui lan bully damsel and give back to LFS, as it was terrorising all my other damsels. i even bought $6 fish trap to get that nasty bully, but too clever for me. now that you mentioned, i felt a little saddened. since that time, i had purchased more LR about 30 kg in all. this time, i add these LR piece by piece, the rest i put in styroform and cycle with air stone and power head. hope i have become more responsible liao. i am now a proud owner of 40 kicking and violent fishes in my tank. newbie lizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member iori_del Posted January 20, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 20, 2005 the flame angel being cheaper was dumped straight into the graveyard. woh, lizard, u are very rich.. a $40 flame is cheap to u.. haiz hope i also like u... But they are still fish and living things leh Quote GIve up liao!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member iori_del Posted January 20, 2005 SRC Member Share Posted January 20, 2005 A)hope i have become more responsible liao. B)i am now a proud owner of 40 kicking and violent fishes in my tank. Bro yr A and B dun match.. 40 fishes? u have a 10 FT tank??? or u got 40 damsel?? seems a lot to be how can u house so many fish together??? Quote GIve up liao!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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