SRC Member fleek Posted September 22, 2010 SRC Member Share Posted September 22, 2010 Hi all, Appreciate your contribution and advises. Let me outline the background first. I bought a marine tank on impulse a small 30L tank, my daughter wanted it. So from the start many fishes died. However, I got the whole thing stable after 5 months, with one fish surviving. So I bought another tank, now it is a 130L tank (30 gallons). Now I am trying to cycle the 130L tank, which is a second hand tank that I have bought. What I have done is to first ensure that the salt content is sufficient. Now, I have to make sure that the tank is sufficient low temperature to match my smaller tank. What I have is a single Chiller, now I must chill both tanks. So my thought is to do so ... 130L tank, pump water (1300 L/hr flow rate) into filter canister (700 L/Hr flow rate), into UV Sterilizer, into Chiller (1/10 HP), into 30L tank. 30L tank pump (1200 L/hr flow rate) into big tank. My protein skimmers are running in both tanks. Appreciate if experienced people can advise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuEl Posted September 22, 2010 Share Posted September 22, 2010 Hi all, Appreciate your contribution and advises. Let me outline the background first. I bought a marine tank on impulse a small 30L tank, my daughter wanted it. So from the start many fishes died. However, I got the whole thing stable after 5 months, with one fish surviving. So I bought another tank, now it is a 130L tank (30 gallons). Now I am trying to cycle the 130L tank, which is a second hand tank that I have bought. What I have done is to first ensure that the salt content is sufficient. Now, I have to make sure that the tank is sufficient low temperature to match my smaller tank. What I have is a single Chiller, now I must chill both tanks. So my thought is to do so ... 130L tank, pump water (1300 L/hr flow rate) into filter canister (700 L/Hr flow rate), into UV Sterilizer, into Chiller (1/10 HP), into 30L tank. 30L tank pump (1200 L/hr flow rate) into big tank. My protein skimmers are running in both tanks. Appreciate if experienced people can advise. Not possible. You will have trouble matching the water flows due to flow restriction and headloss. Only way to only utilize one chiller is drill both tanks, join to a common sump. Chiller plumb to sump. Either get a return pump for each tank or split the return from a single pump into 2. Quote Always something more important than fish. http://reefbuilders.com/2012/03/08/sps-pico-reef/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFOh Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 Hi all, Appreciate your contribution and advises. Let me outline the background first. I bought a marine tank on impulse a small 30L tank, my daughter wanted it. So from the start many fishes died. However, I got the whole thing stable after 5 months, with one fish surviving. So I bought another tank, now it is a 130L tank (30 gallons). Now I am trying to cycle the 130L tank, which is a second hand tank that I have bought. What I have done is to first ensure that the salt content is sufficient. Now, I have to make sure that the tank is sufficient low temperature to match my smaller tank. What I have is a single Chiller, now I must chill both tanks. So my thought is to do so ... 130L tank, pump water (1300 L/hr flow rate) into filter canister (700 L/Hr flow rate), into UV Sterilizer, into Chiller (1/10 HP), into 30L tank. 30L tank pump (1200 L/hr flow rate) into big tank. My protein skimmers are running in both tanks. Appreciate if experienced people can advise. Hai, above setup looks very tedious.. you might need to manual tune the water flow valve in order to prevent overflow due to mismatch.. Ya, join both tank with hole drill like fuel suggested might works.. Bro Vt_Snowman87 is using this concept. Or you can consider gravity feed overflow box... But above both method we better make sure have enough sump volume, to prevent overflow in case power outage.. Cheers and Happy Reefing... Quote LFS Map in singapore __________________ ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º> ·´¯`·.¸. , . .·´¯`·.. >((((º> Cheers and Happy Reefing.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member tunicate Posted September 23, 2010 SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 Hi all, Appreciate your contribution and advises. Let me outline the background first. I bought a marine tank on impulse a small 30L tank, my daughter wanted it. So from the start many fishes died. However, I got the whole thing stable after 5 months, with one fish surviving. So I bought another tank, now it is a 130L tank (30 gallons). Now I am trying to cycle the 130L tank, which is a second hand tank that I have bought. What I have done is to first ensure that the salt content is sufficient. Now, I have to make sure that the tank is sufficient low temperature to match my smaller tank. What I have is a single Chiller, now I must chill both tanks. So my thought is to do so ... 130L tank, pump water (1300 L/hr flow rate) into filter canister (700 L/Hr flow rate), into UV Sterilizer, into Chiller (1/10 HP), into 30L tank. 30L tank pump (1200 L/hr flow rate) into big tank. My protein skimmers are running in both tanks. Appreciate if experienced people can advise. Hi Fleek, There're risk of flooding once your plumbing gets complex. If you only intend to keep fishes in your 30L, there's probably no need for a chiller if water temp is below 31C. A simple hang-on filter together with your existing skimmer would take care of things. Then, you only need to hook up 130L --> canister filter --> chiller --> back to 130L. You need only 1 pump with sufficient power to push water through this loop. Your UV flow needs to be slower to be effective, hence a much smaller pump. (Of course you can also T-off from your main pump with a flow control to the UV, but that would require a bit more DIY plumbing.) What I've described above are 2 separate systems where your floor should be quite safe from flooding even during a power outage. Alternatively, there is a lot more research & work involve if you go the whole 10 yards for a proper Tank-with-sump system. If you do go down this path, below are some of the questions you'll be asking: (1) Cost to drill main tank + overflow construction + 30L tank conversion to sump + plumbing (2) Is there an existing cabinet for 130L to accommodate the 30L sump below? Needs to drill cabinet too. (3) Is the 30L sufficient to contain back flow from 130L during power outage? Purchase new sump tank? (4) Cost of new return pump (5) ....other details... At the end of the day, you'll have a ballpark figure on how much effort & $ is needed. Some people enjoys DIY, but others may just opt to purchase whole system pre-configured. You'll have to decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member fleek Posted September 23, 2010 Author SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 My intention is to eventually move everything to the 130L tank, so the setup is only temporary for cycling purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member tunicate Posted September 23, 2010 SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 My intention is to eventually move everything to the 130L tank, so the setup is only temporary for cycling purpose. Then keep it simple. You don't even need a chiller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gouldian Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 My intention is to eventually move everything to the 130L tank, so the setup is only temporary for cycling purpose. You don't need chiller to cycle your tank. Plum in the chiller when you need to introduce livestocks. Quote "Reefs, like forests, will only be protected in long term if they are appreciated" Dr. J.E.N. Veron Australian Institute of Marine Science -----------------------------------------------------------------------Member of:UEN: T08SS0098FPlease visit us here: http://www.facebook....uaristSocietySG Facebook Group: http://www.facebook....gid=34281892381 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member fleek Posted September 23, 2010 Author SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 In this case how long do I need to cycle the tank? The tank is second hand and I have thrown in some old filtration material from the smaller tank and most of the equipment are bought second hand. I also have some second hand live rocks in the 130L tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member comycus Posted September 23, 2010 SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 the normal cycling process takes 4-6 weeks. You should be monitoring and tracking your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels to assess when your cycling process is completed. Quote My old 3ft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mansiz Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 Do you have live rocks in the tank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member fleek Posted September 23, 2010 Author SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 Yep, I have about 5kg worth of live rocks. I just tested the tanks no ammonia level, nitrate nor nitrite. pH is about 8. Salinity is about 1.021. It has been cycling for the past 6 days and looks ok to me. Only the temp is quite high at 34 without chiller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gouldian Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 Yep, I have about 5kg worth of live rocks. I just tested the tanks no ammonia level, nitrate nor nitrite. pH is about 8. Salinity is about 1.021. It has been cycling for the past 6 days and looks ok to me. Only the temp is quite high at 34 without chiller. Try to add some ammonia source to start the cycling process. This can be 1/4 cube of brain shrimp, let it decompose in your tank, you will be able to register a spike in the ammonia followed by nitrite and then nitrate. Once ammonia and nitrite is zero and nitrate is around 5ppm or lesser, you can safely introduce fishes. As comycus has mentioned cycling takes 4-6 weeks. This is due to the fact that beneficial nitrifying bacteria multiplying takes longer time to multiplying and get to work. Hope that helps. Quote "Reefs, like forests, will only be protected in long term if they are appreciated" Dr. J.E.N. Veron Australian Institute of Marine Science -----------------------------------------------------------------------Member of:UEN: T08SS0098FPlease visit us here: http://www.facebook....uaristSocietySG Facebook Group: http://www.facebook....gid=34281892381 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member fleek Posted September 23, 2010 Author SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 Try to add some ammonia source to start the cycling process. This can be 1/4 cube of brain shrimp, let it decompose in your tank, you will be able to register a spike in the ammonia followed by nitrite and then nitrate. Once ammonia and nitrite is zero and nitrate is around 5ppm or lesser, you can safely introduce fishes. As comycus has mentioned cycling takes 4-6 weeks. This is due to the fact that beneficial nitrifying bacteria multiplying takes longer time to multiplying and get to work. Hope that helps. I dropped a little bit of my dog poop inside the tank and afterwhich there is no amonia after a day, is that considered fine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilsontantw Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 I dropped a little bit of my dog poop inside the tank and afterwhich there is no amonia after a day, is that considered fine? Huh??? Dog poo??? Why would u do that?? Btw how little is little bit? Suggest u put in market prawn or even some dead fish.... But dog poo... Now this is a tough one... Back to plumbing work, best to ensure u r prepared for murphy's visit. Unless u or someone is at home 24x7 to do recovery action in case Murphy drops by, else better to separate the tanks or use a shared sump for a peace of mind... Quote decommissioned 2.5x2x2 Videos: | | Your mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member fleek Posted September 23, 2010 Author SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 Huh??? Dog poo??? Why would u do that?? Btw how little is little bit? Suggest u put in market prawn or even some dead fish.... But dog poo... Now this is a tough one... Back to plumbing work, best to ensure u r prepared for murphy's visit. Unless u or someone is at home 24x7 to do recovery action in case Murphy drops by, else better to separate the tanks or use a shared sump for a peace of mind... What I did was to take some dog poop, about 1/2 cm, drop into a container and with water and then use a drill to stirr it up until it mix well with the water, then I pour the solution into the tank. If the tank can take dog poop, I don't think it can not withstand poop generated by fishes. I know this is extreme test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilsontantw Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 Interesting thought... Do keep us posted once u test the water parameters. For all we know, this can start a new way of tank cycling.. Quote decommissioned 2.5x2x2 Videos: | | Your mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member fleek Posted September 23, 2010 Author SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 The NO3, NO2 and Ammonias are non existent, the test kits, strips all show zero, is that good? I don't know if the test kits expired, but at least the strips are good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member bugattilambo Posted September 23, 2010 SRC Member Share Posted September 23, 2010 What I did was to take some dog poop, about 1/2 cm, drop into a container and with water and then use a drill to stirr it up until it mix well with the water, then I pour the solution into the tank. If the tank can take dog poop, I don't think it can not withstand poop generated by fishes. I know this is extreme test. wow Interesting Idea you have thought by using "Dog poop" anyway use a dead prawn would be better! anyway would like to see the results of the poop! Quote Pain is temporary. It may last a minute, or an hour, or a day, or a year, but eventually it will subside and something else will take its place. If I quit, however, it lasts forever. Member of: www.marineaquarist.sg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilsontantw Posted September 23, 2010 Share Posted September 23, 2010 Well bro. The idea behind cycling is to allow beneficial bacteria to colonise ur system and ensure they can breakdown all the future poo and food or all other dead stuff. Since ur trying this new "raw" material, I guess u must be ready to accept any risk that comes with the experiment? Can try lah, but I suggest trying with a small prawn still. Never hurts to cycle longer, grow more algae and pods... There's no real need to rush to buy corals or fish, they'll always be available. I'm sure someone here must have said this before, patience is the key to this hobby... Good luck and good night bro.. And remember the saying, be safe not sorry... We never know when there'll be a power trip... Just once is considered 1 time too many... Quote decommissioned 2.5x2x2 Videos: | | Your mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member comycus Posted September 24, 2010 SRC Member Share Posted September 24, 2010 The problem with many of us is we drop in the dead prawn, or in your case dog poo and expect our test kits to register an ammonia/nitrite spike immediately. Bro, it's only been 1 day! But then again, we really have no experience with dog poo. lol I would suggest dropping a market prawn coz u start seeing it decompose in front of your eyes. Then again, I heard of people peeing into their tanks. I guess dog poo aint tt extreme! Quote My old 3ft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mansiz Posted September 24, 2010 Share Posted September 24, 2010 The whole process takes about 1 month from the day you drop a dead prawn or dead fish in. By using dog poop, you will have to check if there are other toxic chemical that are not suitable for BB, corals and invert like copper. I would suggest you to remove the dog poop if it is still there and replace it with a dead market prawn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terryz_ Posted September 24, 2010 Share Posted September 24, 2010 (edited) DOG POOP!!!!!!!!!! I dunno where you get the idea from!!! But please ensure there are no residue of the DOG POOP in the tank, God knows what is inside the dog poops... Anyway, the die off from the liverocks that you are using is enough to kick start a ANN cycle unless you are using Dead rocks, I dunno why many reefers still use market prawn to kick start the ANN cycle... And it is not possible to see the Ammonia spike in 1 day, it is a few days thing, it should register in your testkit within 1-2 weeks.. The whole cycling process will take 4-6 weeks without any additional help from additives.. Edited September 24, 2010 by Terryz_ Quote Member of: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member fleek Posted September 24, 2010 Author SRC Member Share Posted September 24, 2010 I have transferred all the fishes. Will update on the outcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divinesloth Posted September 24, 2010 Share Posted September 24, 2010 You da man! I wouldn't even go near the tank water with dog poop! Quote Why all the venom? Reefing is just a hobby, dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRC Member braincoral Posted September 24, 2010 SRC Member Share Posted September 24, 2010 Dog poo? never heard of that before.. BTW Best not to rush into adding livestocks esp during that short cycling as the bacteria might not able to handle it well Patience = the ultimate key in reefing" Keep us posted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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