lesson learnt by a newbie

[shoelevy]

i guess many of u experienced reefers haf at one point or another made very big mistakes that can only be learnt painfully.

well...the same goes for me, over this past 2 week alone, i lost 3 fishes and 2 anemones.

it turns out the fishes died because the anemone was dying and why the anemone died was because i didn't have enough lighting for it.

but the lesson learnt isn't just to add more lighting and knowing more about anemone.

its far greater than that.

as a newbie, i believe the few reasons for my mistake and unfortunate demise of my lifestocks is

1)impatience - a deadly recipe. the anemone died because i was impatient. infact, i didn't even read up much about it and just bought it. a result of this is its death.

2) cheap skate - many newbies will be ovewhelmed by the amount needed to start up this hobby...but make not mistake, it doesn't mean u should try and save here and there....my experience with this hobby is the more u try to save, the more u spend. allow me to elaborate:when u save and buy something not as good or not as suitable to operate, u soon realise that they don't work up to your expectations and the result of that is to go buy better and more expensive ones, resulting in the total amt spent being MORE than a newbies original intention of saving.

the mistake i made in this area was not knowing how important lighting was and tried to buy a cheap cheap flouro light. had i known and invested in MH lights, my anemone wouldn't have died. the other experiece i had was to save on the initial costs by get a 6mm thick 4footer when it should haf been 8 or 10mm.now, i haf to get a new tank thick enough. i also haf lots of problems trying to convert my canister filtered system to a sump filtered one.....i tried to save on the costs of getting the tank drilled and decided to use a canister....now i know sumps are better and not only do i haf to spend on the oveflow box but i haf problems trying to get the sump up because i haf to transfer alot of stuff over and i cannot turn the canisters off unless the sump is set up properly

3)unscrupulous dealers: some dealers out there are dishonest and sell used stuff or sub standards one.

i got cheated once and it resulted in the thing not being able to be used. it was $50 cheated off me.

so to all newbies who wish to get into this hobby, my advice is don't try and save on unneccasary things, read up and ask around, get to know the comments on certain shops u r interested in and finally, the most important virtue of all is be PATIENT...

hope this will be of help to all

[Marineman]

Other than what you said above, newbies MUST check for more information on the hardiness, compatability, behaviour, feeding methods, captive care which includes water movement, lighting requirement etc. of the coral/fish they intend to buy before jumping into it.

There are an abundance of info in the internet and if you don't understand ask the fellow reefers in this forum.

[shoelevy]

that's rite

i encourage all with such experience to share so that others don't make the same mistake.

everyone knows it hurts when realise u make a mistake esp with this hobby so lets share to help others avoid them

[Melvyn Tan]

Thats y i added a thread to request for posting on your best purchased equipment in terms of value-performance so that others can consider.

[Travy]

Man.. i have to say i am guilty of the 'canister filter' sin...

kinda regret it liao, thats why spent alot of money on a good Protein

Skimmer.

Flora Tubes are okay i think. Its working for me, The important thing is the intensity and the correct spectrum.

For my 2 ft i have 3 day light and 1 blue tube.

The lighting and teh skimmer set me back by almost 300 bucks man...

But facing a NO3 problem now. SOurcing for remedies... Think i', gonna spend quite alot on it again...

[lightningstrike]

Man.. i have to say i am guilty of the 'canister filter' sin...

I'll hv to disagree wif saying using cannister filter as a "sin". i myself is a user of cannister. yes, i do agree that a sump gives u better and more options. but for ppl with space constraints, using a cannister might only be the next best thing. it depends on wat u place in ur cannister. for me, i put nothing but only GAC and polyfilter. no harm done. as long as u can afford to do regular maintenance.

as for fluroscent lights, IMHO, it is not going to be enuff even for the simplest of hard corals. unless u hv a really really shallow tank or a FOWLR. i suspect that it is not going to be enuff to keep softies.

juz me 2 cents.

[decentkid]

its better to get more expensive and better equipment at the start...thats what i learnt...initial investments....

after buying some stuff which one thinks its sufficient and dont wish to get better items...later finds out that the equipment is not appropriate at all and have to change in....in turn one have to spend more....

[Gouldian]

Well bro,

That's is always the case. I struggled to convince a newbie to buy my CR Aquarium 2ft instead of a cheaper alternative and in end I lost.

Anyway, from what you have mentioned, I know you have learn alot with this experience liao and I believe will be able to prevent those mistakes in the future.

Good luck and all the best!

[oshkosh]

Hi guys,

Here's my 2 cents.

It's not how much you spend. Its what you spend on and how to work within your budget.

If you go by the thinking that you should start off with the best, ie. the biggest tank, MH, some super duper skimming, sump & filtration system, half a ton of LR, the most accurate test kits, the most delicious fish food and the most well received supplements, then having sufficient pocket money is one hell of a barrier to newbies. (Not applicable to those with silver spoons)

Do you research, ask around, find out about equipment, livestock, etc. You'll find that you can get by with just a basic setup.

If you only keep damsels, you can get by with a small tank, simple overflow filter, PL light, and a cheap test kit. (Of course its not so simple!).

Along the way, when you have more money, you can improve things like putting in a skimmer, invest in a better test kit, etc.

In short, start small and simple. Cultivate the hobby. Plan your upgrades according to the finances available. This way, you don't have to survive on bread and water.

The most important thing to note is; If you have a simple setup, just stick to hardy fishes. Leave the more demanding livestocks like anemones, SPS, certain fishes out till you have better equipment to ensure their survival.

Do enjoy your hobby. Cheers.

[iori_del]

I'll hv to disagree wif saying using cannister filter as a "sin". i myself is a user of cannister. yes, i do agree that a sump gives u better and more options. but for ppl with space constraints, using a cannister might only be the next best thing. it depends on wat u place in ur cannister. for me, i put nothing but only GAC and polyfilter. no harm done. as long as u can afford to do regular maintenance.

as for fluroscent lights, IMHO, it is not going to be enuff even for the simplest of hard corals. unless u hv a really really shallow tank or a FOWLR. i suspect that it is not going to be enuff to keep softies.

juz me 2 cents.

I am getting worried too, keep seeing ppl say bad things abt canister, but i really dun have the space to start a sump....

SO i use 2 x 2028 for my 4 x 1,5 x 1,5 is it a newbie mistake?

[Domino]

Hi Shoelevy!

It's a very interesting point you brought up. But I disagree with the fact that beginners should from the start get the best stuff because: first that is a lot of money in one chunk and second you're only starting, you don't even know if you'll stick to the hobby... But I agree with you that in the end you want and need the best quality stuff.

There is a way to have a natural progression: For example I stated off last january with a 4 Ft tank doing a FOWLR. For this you don't need big lights (i had 2x30WFL ) and not even a great skimmer (used a Jebo) if you use a lot of LR. For 8 months, my tank matured slowly, I gained experience. Not a single fish died. BUT i knew the limits of my setup: no corals and no anemones. To decorate I put a few tubeworms in the LR.

As I gained experience I replaced the canister for a sump wih DSB, I added a chiller, I upgraded the skimmer (Weipro - better but still not great) and recently only added the MH lights. I had a chiller running for months on a FOWLR without critical need. Now only, I introduce some corals (cautious because or NO3 level).

Really, you must be PATIENT as you point out very well and you must PLAN. You can split the cost of your tank over a longer period (less painful financially) and get more hobby time for money. The day there is nothing to do on my tank and there is no challenge, I might quit the hobby. As you gain experience, you learn how to choose the good equipment too. It wouldn't be fun if I started straight away with the best of everything on day one.

cheers

[shoelevy]

its better to get more expensive and better equipment at the start...thats what i learnt...initial investments....

after buying some stuff which one thinks its sufficient and dont wish to get better items...later finds out that the equipment is not appropriate at all and have to change in....in turn one have to spend more....

this is very true

newbies, pls learn from this

[shoelevy]

Hi Shoelevy!

It's a very interesting point you brought up. But I disagree with the fact that beginners should from the start get the best stuff because: first that is a lot of money in one chunk and second you're only starting, you don't even know if you'll stick to the hobby... But I agree with you that in the end you want and need the best quality stuff.

There is a way to have a natural progression: For example I stated off last january with a 4 Ft tank doing a FOWLR. For this you don't need big lights (i had 2x30WFL ) and not even a great skimmer (used a Jebo) if you use a lot of LR. For 8 months, my tank matured slowly, I gained experience. Not a single fish died. BUT i knew the limits of my setup: no corals and no anemones. To decorate I put a few tubeworms in the LR.

As I gained experience I replaced the canister for a sump wih DSB, I added a chiller, I upgraded the skimmer (Weipro - better but still not great) and recently only added the MH lights. I had a chiller running for months on a FOWLR without critical need. Now only, I introduce some corals (cautious because or NO3 level).

Really, you must be PATIENT as you point out very well and you must PLAN. You can split the cost of your tank over a longer period (less painful financially) and get more hobby time for money. The day there is nothing to do on my tank and there is no challenge, I might quit the hobby. As you gain experience, you learn how to choose the good equipment too. It wouldn't be fun if I started straight away with the best of everything on day one.

cheers

yeah, i get your point too

planning and patience are key to this hobby.

i remembered for my current tank, i was impatient, cycled for a week, then added 7 fishes in first week, 2nd week added 5 then following week add 3 fish and 2 anemone and the last week add 4 fish with 3 corals. not to mention my skimmer is rated 150l while my tank is 200l cos i wanna save money for more lifestock.

total disaster!!!, now my tank beggining to crash, already 5 fishes dead in 3 days and the rest have signs of white spot...and anemone not enough light also dead.

i'm praying for the best that many will survive till this weekend when i book out frmo camp and get my sump up and better skimmer running.

i've only had this tank for 2 months.

i am totally regretting im[patience

[terryansimon]

actually there is no right or wrong regarding the school of thought in investment of equipment during the initial phase or later stages.

investing in equipment during the initial phases, though a big bullet to bite in terms of finances, is much better as you do not need to upgrade to a better piece of hardware in the long run. I'm glad to say that the only thing I suffered in this case is the fact that I chose aesthetics and funky technology and went for my T5s instead of going straight for MHs. now I'm using MHs, sold my T5s for a dirt cheap price, and basically wasted a truck load of money and time.

the other way to look at it is that the cost saving measures taken by buying lesser equipment during the start up phase will be a measure of your interest. by saying that, I mean that should you suddenly lose interest over a failed setup *which a lot of people do, trust me*, the financial losses are much lesser than if you were to buy the state of the art equipment.

buying less high tech equipment also grooms you in terms of husbandry skills and the tricks of the marine aquarium. over-dependence on technology is a thing that all of us fall prey to, and it may lead to the same adoption of mentality when it comes to marine tanks. what used to be routine water changes to maintain pristine water conditions for the tank has been removed from the agenda, simply because "I got a skimmer that is over-rated for the tank by ten times." yes, technology can help you and aid in keeping your tank inhabitants healthy, but nothing beats a healthy attitude from the reefer and doing regular maintenance.

nobody buys a Ferrari and drives it around without taking care of it by polishing its body, pumping in the best fuel, giving it the best car maintenance package available, etc. the same mentality should be adopted to the marine tank. replace polishing with cleaning the physical aspects of the tank, replace fuel with periodic water changes, car maintenance with husbandry skills like ensuring water conditions fall within a certain set of parameters.

with all these in mind, you'll have a Ferrari *of sorts* sitting in your home, with you to admire it at night when you're dead tired! (=

[iori_del]

Me too try to save here and there, bought a 4 ft dbl FL light and now selling at a small loss..

MAybe getting a Dymax cheap T5 will be good enuff as seriously, i really dun know how long can i hold on to this new hobby.

Can i ask is canister filtering a newbie mistake? have advise another friend who is a newbie to go canister too. hope i am not wrong..

[lightningstrike]

hi iori del, pls read my previous post in this thread.

[iori_del]

hi iori del, pls read my previous post in this thread.

bro i saw 2026(acting as GAC Reactor). wat does tat mean?

think u have a sump rite?

[marcvelous]

Agree that there is no right or wrong where equipment choice is concerned...

My experience (amongst others):

1. A former reefer who boasted of his 5ft setup with supposedly some of the best equipment available in the market. Seemed to have great plans and all. After ANN cycle, bought 20 fishes and dumped them ALL in at the same time. All 20 up the lorry. Sold his entire setup less than 2 months after setup now like disappeared, never to be heard from again.

2. People who are firm believers in "Nothing but the best" and just keeps buying and buying and upgrading and upgrading, even with some of whom are dirt poor.

I think a better rule would be to start small and start simple. Take the time to decide for yourself if you like it and verify if it's a real hobby or puppy love/infatuation caused by media (eg Finding Nemo). Then slowly upgrade be it a bigger tank or better and more costly equipment. This is not only more sensible for yourself (finances, space, family for those not living alone, etc) but also more responsible to the creatures in your tank, some although cheap are no less alive than you or me.

A small tank can be converted into a quarantine or hospital tank. Worse comes to worst, you can easily give away or donated to cousins or nearby schools/childcare for freshwater aquariums.

There are also lot of people around, trumpet-blowers, unscrupulous dealers, etc who will lead you the wrong way be it cheap or expensive equipment. PURELY just sharing my experience and no offense to anyone, I started out with a 3ft and listened extensively to one particular reefer who seemed to be an expert to me (he had like a few thousand posts even though he joined for only a few months!!! Later then I know most of them emoticons or irrelevant one-liners). End up most of the "advice" he gave were nonsense and I spent and spent to remedy the errors.

I have since downgraded my setup to a 2ft and is finally loving this hobby like I never have before.

Just my two cents...