Ocean's Blend

[hotbod999]

Hi,

Just like to share with fellow aquarist about this great product that I've used and tested. Forgive me but I didn't mean to write such a long message but I'm on MC today (not geng ok! ) and have lots of time at home so thought of sharing with you guys.

It's called Ocean's Blend and I managed to get a friend to get it for me from the states.

I've tried Reef Solution, Koralin S-plus, Marc Weiss and you name it I've tried it. I'm not saying Reef Solution is no good, but there's no calcium in it and you've got to buy a separate calcium solution or kalwasser or calcium reactor to complement it. I'm too lazy to do that. As for Korallin S-plus, you are supposed to add it once a week and it claimed that those unused minerals etc will dissolved itself by it's matrix (or something like that). The problem with this is that after adding it, I guarantee you that the next day your aquarium will be covered with unwanted algae! This you can check with fellow aquarist who have use it before. Moreover, as with Reef Solution, no Calcium is included.

I would really recommend this Ocean's Blend that I've used and am still using. It comes with 2 bottles (titled 'pH/Alkalinity' and 'Calcium'). It is the closest trace element additive to the ocean. I was skeptical at first but after using it there's no doubt about it. Moreover, who can claim that??? You just have to dose it either everyday or every other day or according to your calcium measurements in the tank. Personally I use it 2 -3 times a week and nothing else is added. I used to use Seachem products but now I don't have to buy a separate calcium, strontium, magnesium..............

I guess it's good news for me as I chance upon it in Reborn yeterday and they are selling it! It comes in TWO 16 oz bottles selling at only $50! (1 bottle of 16 oz Reef Solution is already selling at $45! I guess Ocean's Blend is cheaper because they dont 'bluff' you with fancy packaging) I bought it for over $60 from my friend!

I managed to grab a piece of leaflet there on this and check out their website (www.alphamarinereef.com) on the product, they state where to buy the products too, I think they should advertise in sgreefclub too so that people will know.... maybe I'll try to see where I can get it cheaper...heeheehee....... I've read reviews on www.premiumaquatics.com and www.theculturedreef.com and the reviews are all great.

Maybe you guys should check it out too.

HB

[corrado]

hi all

this product is real cool.

my prison warden friend dosed some into

Shankar's diet under his request to strengthen

his pelvic prior canning. *bad joke*

[Achilles Tang]

You confused it with another product called, "Offender's bend"

[corrado]

hi Ref

Bad tackle. No malice. no booking please.

please kindly delete if deemed unfit.

the hatchet man.

[Achilles Tang]

LOL!! No harm done.

[Tanzy]

Thanks for the review but I think you fail to understand some very important points in reef water chemistry. I can make negatives comments regarding any "All-in-one" product but I decide to read the manufacturer website first.

We feel that the additives you add to your reef aquarium should be as close to Mother Nature as possible. Why? Needless to say, The closer you make your reef tank to the ocean the better growth and diverse your aquarium will be.

It's not about what you add, it's about what you replace. Assuming that the above premise is true. Wouldn't blind dosing of elements create an inbalance in the water that deviates from Mother Nature? Since different tanks and system utilise elements and nutrients differently, how can you replace and element you cannot measure to ensure that it is in the correct natural range?

Next, the above premise is not completely true. SPS grow much faster than in nature when alkalinity and calcium levels are elevated compared to the natural sea levels. Farmed Tridacnid clams are grown in water slightly enriched with nitrates (at levels that will remain undetectable with hobby testkits) to increase their growth rate. Do you fertilize your plants?

Which brings us to the next claim

NO NEED! Ocean’s Blend is a FULL ADDITIVE! No other additives are needed and get this…… it maintains alkalinity between 3.0 meg/L and 4.0 meg/L……. AND maintains pH levels between 8.2 - 8.4…… AND maintains calcium levels between 400 ppm and 450ppm!

How is an all-in-one additive going to adjust itself to provide different amounts of individual elements for each individual tank out there? This product is a Two-part element so same volumes of both solutions are added each time. Calcium and alkalinity is always increased proportionally. If calcium is at the right level but alkalinity is depressed and the the user doses the right amount to maintain the calcium that is used up, the alkalinity will remain depressed. If the user compensates for the depressed alkalinity and doses more of the two-part to increase it, calcium will be overdosed. All-in-one products cannot logically exist. Therefore this product cannot possibly automatically maintain calcium or alkalinity levels in the desired range. Also, again, different tanks have different rate of element usage so the manufacturer can only at best provide an arbitrary dosing regiment.

Finally

Ocean’s Blend is different from other products such that it combats algae by containing no nitrates or phosphates, precipitating phosphates, having a low iron content, and, get this, it uses Reverse Osmosis / DOUBLE Deionized water !

Most good reef products out there do not contain nitrates or phosphate so nothing special here. It is a unspoken MANDATORY requirement actually for any reef additive. Two-parts do not precipitate phosphates because they do not have a sufficiently high pH in the calcium component of the solutions.

What the heck is DOUBLE Deionized water? Passing it twice through the DI column? For what? The first DI column is faulty?

Conclusion:

This is a Two-part and nothing special or different from other Two-parts out there. The manufacturer unscrupulously hyped up the product and made unscientific and illogical claims to increase sales. This is a classic "dupe the eager newbie" trick. Almost all manufacturers practice this to a certain extent. We should all be aware of this.

This is nothing against hotbod999 (Do you really have a hot body?) but just an attempt to debunk this product.

[hotbod999]

Wow, this seems like a student doing thesis or a strong supporter of a competitor. I believe half of the people either don't know what you are talking about or are simply lost in your 'thesis'. Anyway, this is a review, not a place to vent your frustation after your bad experience with other products.

And thanks but I think you are the one who failed bigtime to understand some very important points in reef water chemistry.

So now let's start making things clear:

1)

I can make negatives comments regarding any "All-in-one" product but I decide to read the manufacturer website first.

QUOTE (http://www.alphamarinereef.com/public/oceans_blend.html)

First, if you have done your research, you will realise that http://www.alphamarinereef.com/public/oceans_blend.html is not the manufacturer's website.

The manufacturer's website is www.oceansblend.com. This can be found simply by typing ocean's blend in a search engine. Very simple.

2)

It's not about what you add, it's about what you replace

Errrr...don't you add something in order to replace??? And it's exactly what you add in the tank that matters. This product is added to replace and make your water parameters closest to the natural ocean, not added to add more things to your tank. Please read carefully.

3)

Assuming that the above premise is true. Wouldn't blind dosing of elements create an inbalance in the water that deviates from Mother Nature? Since different tanks and system utilise elements and nutrients differently, how can you replace and element you cannot measure to ensure that it is in the correct natural range?

Who ask you to dose blindly???? Which product would ask you to dose blindly??? Yours???

you said "different tanks and system utilise elements and nutrients differently"???

If you have done your research or study more, you will understand that fishes, corals and creatures of the ocean practically uses the same trace elements. It's a matter of using how much of each. So you should say each different species uses trace elements in different amounts.

you said "how can you replace and element you cannot measure".....errrrrrr.....Do you know what test kits are for??? Don't make the lovely creatures in your tank suffer, use test kits please.

4)

Next, the above premise is not completely true. SPS grow much faster than in nature when alkalinity and calcium levels are elevated compared to the natural sea levels. Farmed Tridacnid clams are grown in water slightly enriched with nitrates (at levels that will remain undetectable with hobby testkits) to increase their growth rate. Do you fertilize your plants?

you said:"SPS grow much faster than in nature when alkalinity and calcium levels are elevated compared to the natural sea levels."

Oh, so you are trying to say those people keeping SPS cannot keep LPS? Then it's time for us LPS keepers to throw away our LPS!

Hey, as mentioned earlier, that's what test kits are for, to measure how much calcium and other stuff are left in our tank. Use test kits please.

you said: "Farmed Tridacnid clams are grown in water slightly enriched with nitrates (at levels that will remain undetectable with hobby testkits) to increase their growth rate. Do you fertilize your plants?"

BTW, all clams grow better in water with higher nitrate level...even the cockles that we eat (or 'see harm' as we call it). So you mean you buy nitrate and add more nitrate into your tank to feed your clams and plants? I believe people are laughing their head off right now. I really can't believe how you learn to keep marine species.

BTW, how do you keep your nitrate level low? or do you keep a clams-only tank? LOL

5)

How is an all-in-one additive going to adjust itself to provide different amounts of individual elements for each individual tank out there? This product is a Two-part element so same volumes of both solutions are added each time. Calcium and alkalinity is always increased proportionally. If calcium is at the right level but alkalinity is depressed and the the user doses the right amount to maintain the calcium that is used up, the alkalinity will remain depressed. If the user compensates for the depressed alkalinity and doses more of the two-part to increase it, calcium will be overdosed. All-in-one products cannot logically exist. Therefore this product cannot possibly automatically maintain calcium or alkalinity levels in the desired range. Also, again, different tanks have different rate of element usage so the manufacturer can only at best provide an arbitrary dosing regiment.

you said "How is an all-in-one additive going to adjust itself to provide different amounts of individual elements for each individual tank out there?"

That's what this product is about! And that's what test kits are for!

Duh...

you said "This product is a Two-part element so same volumes of both solutions are added each time. Calcium and alkalinity is always increased proportionally. If calcium is at the right level but alkalinity is depressed and the the user doses the right amount to maintain the calcium that is used up, the alkalinity will remain depressed. If the user compensates for the depressed alkalinity and doses more of the two-part to increase it, calcium will be overdosed."

That is why this is a two part additive and they should be use together to complement each other (you mentioned it yourself) so why are you beating your own words? Well, let me say it again, that's what test kits are for, and people who has a logical mind wouldn't add more calcium when their calcium level is already at 450ppm. And the good thing about this product is that when the level of one property is at the expected range, the other is usually also at the expected range. Do you still feed yourself when you are super full? Nobody ask you to add it without using brains.

Most good reef products out there do not contain nitrates or phosphate so nothing special here. It is a unspoken MANDATORY requirement actually for any reef additive. Two-parts do not precipitate phosphates because they do not have a sufficiently high pH in the calcium component of the solutions.

What the heck is DOUBLE Deionized water? Passing it twice through the DI column? For what? The first DI column is faulty?

Well, I'm pretty sure you either don't use additive or you are only a one-product user (like stubbornly sticking to cycling a trishaw when there's a lexus waiting for you). If you have tried different additive, you will realise that some will create problems like algae bloom. Some don't, but they do not contain calcium, thus you have to add calcium separately be it in the form of kalwasser or using a calcium reactor etc, and to add calcium separately would bring out problems in balancing the pH/Alkalinity and calcium like you've mentioned before. Clear?

you said: "what the heck is DOUBLE Deionized water?"

If you don't understand, please read more before you make comments.

CONCLUSION

Conclusion:

This is a Two-part and nothing special or different from other Two-parts out there. The manufacturer unscrupulously hyped up the product and made unscientific and illogical claims to increase sales. This is a classic "dupe the eager newbie" trick. Almost all manufacturers practice this to a certain extent. We should all be aware of this.

you said "This is a Two-part and nothing special or different from other Two-parts out there. The manufacturer unscrupulously hyped up the product and made unscientific and illogical claims to increase sales. "

Have you use it before??? If not don't make such strong and bias comments. You are just like saying the brand Lacoste is the same as brand Crocodile. You will be sued for making this statement. Be prepared that somebody will contact AT for your contact details and IP address. I'm sure AT will tell you that comments stated in any form of medium in the World Wide Web may be deemed malicious resulting in defamation and such comments can be used as evidence in a court of law.

As a user of this product and this forum, I strongly support logical comments or statements or even a few harmless jokes, but not bias or 'link-it-with-other-lousy-products' comments when a person haven't even try it. And please do more research before making apparent argumentative comments/statements.

(If you don't try the Char Kway Teow offer by the food stall, how do you know whether his Char Keow Teow is good or bad?) So those who are skeptical about the product can easily check with other users or go to other websites or any other media not related to the manufacturer to check out reviews on this product, or they can simply just try it out; no harm in trying it anyway. I've tried it that's why I know. I'm still using it and guess what? All my fishes, SPS, LPS etc etc etc are doing perfectly well and are propagating. Even better then when I'm using REEF Solution. Don't believe? Then you are definitely welcome to my place to view my tank.

[pacificbetta]

Just came back from lunch. Good post-lunch entertainment.

[Achilles Tang]

hotbod999,

You seem to feel so offended by Tanzy's point of view. Why do you use such words as "You will be sued for making this statement. Be prepared that somebody will contact AT for your contact details and IP address." Are YOU going to be one to report to Ocean's Blend how a reefer feels about the product? How many negative views will they sue?

If that was seriously the case, ALL of us who feel that many products out the world are snake oil, not entirely truthful, or have dubious magical powers will be sued to thy kingdom come!!!

I was looking forward to a interesting point by point rebuttal by Tanzy with all points you counter-claimed. TILL I got to the part where you let go about sueing and stuff. I can't help but be curious if you are the distributor or have some financial interest in this very new product. It is quite rare for someone to rave and rant about a product that claims to do everything everything it says on the label and attribute it to how nice his tank looks.

If you want my opinion, there are many many beautiful tanks out there who have never used such additives, including my own and it seems like you have picked a nice sparring partner like Tanzy to debate the finer points about the product's claims.

If you don't know what he's studying in UK now... I suggest you pick a simpler subject because he's not fondly called our wise old resident sea turtle for nothing.

I suggest you KEEP it to JUST a DEBATE and since you are new here, I suggest you also try to be a bit more courteous. Any more word about suing and curtailing of negative opinions from others with regards to this product and I'm not going to be so understanding next time.

Now its your call how you want to swing this conversation.

AT

[roidan]

hmm...interesting debate going on...

but dun use words like sue or lawsuit lah...quite sensitive...and also dun doubt the intelligence of the other party lah....

i mean..keep the debate to the item and dun start throwing personal attacks lor...

cmon...tons of such products out there...if every single item have to debate like this....aiyo....world war...

and somemore coming from a person with not many post history...such intense support for a product may bring along the unwanted *tag* that the person is linked in some way to the product....

but if that is not the case, great to see someone fighting hard for some product he believes in....but like i said...keep the arguement objective...hehehe...

my 2cents

[Tanzy]

Hey! Calm down. I don't support any particular brand of additives or supplement. I am merely analyzing this product and sharing what I think of it just as you are doing. Perhaps we may be on the different sides of the coin, that's all. This is also not a place for you to vent your frustration when people rationally speak negatively against your product.

I don't even know where to start against your emotionally charged rebuttal. OK, firstly, no hobby testkit for trace element exists and I doubt one will be developed any time soon due to the complicated chemistry involved. Strontium and magnesium testkits as it is are not very accurate because of interference from calcium. Since you advocate and remind all of us to use testkits, I will put it to you again, how do you dose trace elements without testing? Isn't that blind dosing if you can't determine the levels?

My bad, I went to the wrong website but my stance remains the same because after a short perusal of Ocean's Bland, I find that the claims made on http://www.alphamarinereef.com/public/oceans_blend.html are just cut and paste quotes from the former. Therefore, quoting alphamarinereef.com was similar to quoting Ocean's Bland.

I said "SPS grow much faster than in nature when alkalinity and calcium levels are elevated compared to the natural sea levels." to illustrate that natural levels of elements aren't always the ideal. I subsequently gave the example of clams saying "Farmed Tridacnid clams are grown in water slightly enriched with nitrates (at levels that will remain undetectable with hobby testkits) to increase their growth rate. Do you fertilize your plants?"

I was struggling to make sense of your reply "Oh, so you are trying to say those people keeping SPS cannot keep LPS? Then it's time for us LPS keepers to throw away our LPS!". Please enlighten my pitiful ignorant self as to how your statement is relevant to the subject at hand. It's interesting how you can deduce such an absurd claim. Also, again referring to the clam and nitrate discussion mentioned above, I have stated that clams do better with nitrate fertilization, to which, you replied "BTW, all clams grow better in water with higher nitrate level...even the cockles that we eat (or 'see harm' as we call it). So you mean you buy nitrate and add more nitrate into your tank to feed your clams and plants? I believe people are laughing their head off right now. I really can't believe how you learn to keep marine species." I don't see a disagreement there but you made insinuations against my ability to "keep marine species". Does that make you feel more able to "keep marine species"?

Like you said, if some one who has testkits and know what he is doing won't overdose the the Two-part when calcium is at optimum level, but assuming that alkalinity is low, again I assert, how can continued dosing of the two-part in the correct amounts increase alkalinity to the normal range as claimed by the manufacturer?

For the benefit of others and in the name of science, please explain the rationale behind double DI water? I really don't what is it. You seem pretty knowledgeable.

Sue me? You must be kidding. Don't treaten me with the Laws you don't know. Besides, AT doesn't need to give my IP address to anyone unless ordered by the Singapore Courts. The manufacturer must be able to substantiate their claims first. I have made my case and tried my best to explain it logically. I have nothing to fear. Have you seen the posts made on Reef.org or Reefcentral in USA? They are a hotbed for libel suits! Of course it won't hurt the sales of a product if a company attempts to sue a reefer, right?

As a user of this product and this forum, I strongly support logical comments or statements or even a few harmless jokes,

I'll agree to that wholeheartedly but some people just don't get it.

but not bias or 'link-it-with-other-lousy-products' comments when a person haven't even try it. And please do more research before making apparent argumentative comments/statements.

Don't you ever practice what you preach? How about you not make biased "link-it-with-the-miracle-of-the-virgin-birth-products"? Ya, do your research! Basic maths and chemistry are all you need. You don't have to use a product to know if it works or not. Applying science and logical deduction, I can decide if a product will work or not. If I told you to add 1000mL of olive oil to your tank everyday for it to look good will you do it? Hopefully you'll say no way. Did you try and test it to find out if it works before you said no? What made you decide against it? Using your char kway teow analogy, if you see a hawker that adds a lot of salt and rotten cockles to the char kway teow, do you need to taste it to know that it will taste bad? How do you know? Isn't it by induction?

Seeing your tank doesn't proof anything. I can show you many more tanks that don't use this product and that are equally presentable if not better.

I like the way you think. It's special. Don't let anyone take that away from you. Don't take things on this board too seriously.

[Tanzy]

Just came back from lunch. Good post-lunch entertainment.

You get a medal if you read the whole post word for word without skipping.

[ryan]

yeah my eyes are too...

haha...

very interesting debate...

"de-bate" is de thing you catch de fish with!

[arcanehacker]

they sound like 'the architech' from Matrix.. I tried to follow but eventually got lost somewhere..

[Achilles Tang]

I love a good debate! Its de bate that catch de fish! Haha.. bad joke.

Frankly, this product in question has similar sounding claims to many similar products out there. I can name just a few... who use appealing words like funky, miracle, catalytic nutrient stabilizing solution, all you need in one bottle, blows you away, does everything but gives your fish sparkling white teeth!

I left these stuff alone when I research enough on trace elements and only monitored what is more important and critical in a reef tank environment.

As Tanzy has rightly pointed out, there are so many trace elements out there and there are only a few specialized test kits for them. You can't test for all of them and there's really no way to know if you're overdosing it. Overdosing of trace elements is supposedly contributing to heavy metal buildup in a reef tank, causing a crash in due time.

Even if you have SPS corals which possibly takes up more trace elements than slower growing soft corals or LPS corals, it's still difficult to measure. Those you can, you can dose SPECIFICALLY that to raise it up. But if everything is in a ALL-IN-ONE-BOTTLE, how do you KNOW for a fact what you're NOT overdosing??

Worred about trace elements depletion? The next water change will replenish it!

Don't sweat the small stuff people! My 2 cents!

AT

[Achilles Tang]

yeah my eyes are too...

haha...

very interesting debate...

"de-bate" is de thing you catch de fish with!

Ah Ryan... i see you share my taste in corny one liners!

[Benz...]

yeah my eyes are too...

haha...

very interesting debate...

"de-bate" is de thing you catch de fish with!

no school ar??? reading this take loads of your time you know....

[ryan]

Ah Ryan... i see you share my taste in corny one liners!

haha!

oh yeah...

didn't think anyone else would know that line...

[Achilles Tang]

Was it from "Allo Allo"?

[ryan]

no school ar??? reading this take loads of your time you know....

have sch lah...

but in libarary cuz now having break...

[ryan]

Was it from "Allo Allo"?

whats that?

the CD is it?

[AlfaRomeo]

Wah, i think this is the first time i see sumone trying to debate with tanzy on topics like this and its not much of a debate afterall judging from hotbod's reply to tanzy. Me being a complete newbie can see the logic full of holes.. pretty big ones too..

[Achilles Tang]

I look forward to logical debates, so, everyone, please contribute your point of views!

But pls your check in your emotions at the door.

Heated debates are fine as long as no rudeness or hostility is allowed to break the peace.

[woonming]

Trace elements could be replace by water change using a good brand of salts..

Not forgetting too much strontium would cos more harm than good for your corals..

My point would be itis a full sps reef system using Ocean's Blend alone for it calcium intake would not be enough..

[Achilles Tang]

I used to get free samples of Korallin S-plus from my HK Korallin distributor friend and I don't recall any visible results, negative or positive.

I tried other trace elements solutions and again, I see no diff too.

I personally think that dosing of trace elements overated. Heck, sometimes, I don't even dose the extra trace elements packet included in Coralife salt!

I just monitor the more important calcium, alk, ph parameters. Magnesium, iodide, strontium occasionally or it can be even neglected for long periods.

I don't sweat the small stuff.

But since the topic is more about two-part calcium additives. It's an easy solution for those with small tanks. But because every tank is different... Calcium, alkalinity and PH may drop at different rates, using a two-part may still not address how to fix too much of an imbalance.

You may still have to get seperate calcium and alkalinity additives to correct any imbalances.