Sumps

[RMX]

from what i understand, ppl with 2ft tanks can do without sumps or overflow or refugium etc. some may even think its ridiculous to set up any elaborate external filteration system for 2ft tanks.

but if sumps can be done away with for 2ft, is there really a need for sumps for tanks bigger than 2ft (eg 3ft, 4ft). because the water volume is already so much greater than 2ft. and if 2ft can survive without sump filteration, can 4ft sustain?

[Phang]

Basically it depends on what you are looking for...and what you expect to be housed in your sump...

for example, if you look at the setups of the Americans, you will realise that many have larger than usual sumps.. some even have refugiums incorporated into their system..

Again the larger the volume of water , the more forgiving the system is towards the mistakes that sometimes we make...

Yes, there are systems that have survive with a small volume of water, but with marine, it takes jus a small mistake or some negligence and everything goes wrong.... esp. when you intend to keep more sensitive invertebrates...

[Achilles Tang]

A sump is defined as a connected tank of water which can be of any size.

It is a place where equipment such as protein skimmers, submerged pumps, uv light canisters and other filtration stuff can be hidden away in.

Imagine if all these equipment are in your main tank (like skimmers used in small tanks) or lying around in a cabinet and leaking water?

Where is the output from an overflow going to go to?

Not every pump can be plumped externally... eg. small pumps for feeding skimmers etc.

So a sump is practical for the above reasons.

A sump would be important for increasing the volume of water in the system as Phang said, making it more stable and forgiving with any fluctuations in pollution, heat, cold etc.

And in case of a power cutoff, the backflow of water from the pumps/overflow may not result in an overflow of water onto your floor if your sump can hold enough volume to compensate!

You may have a tiny 1 foot tank but if you have a huge sump, you will be in better shape than a 4 foot tank with no sump.

Get the logic?

[RMX]

actually, im thinking whether a large tank can sustain without overflow and the likes. an overflow box in the tank looks out of place and takes up space. if 2ft can sustain without gadgets like UV or chillers or even protein skimmers(using liverocks and sandbed as filteration), i dun see the reason why large tanks need them.

i believe weekly water change will actually suffice? am i rite to say that?

[Achilles Tang]

If you have lots of money and time to do weekly water changes for a 4 feet tank... by all means... even a 100,000 gallon tank can get by with no equipment necessary (except lights) if you do weekly or daily water changes!

I have not changed water in my tank for more than a few months already as my filtration system inclusive of skimmer and the use of Polyfilters seems to be stable enough for my corals and fish.

But everytime I drain out, dump, make saltwater to change out 25% of my tank... my back aches like hell. Maybe I am getting old?

A sump is not essential but it's a must-have for the reasons I stated below... especially for big tanks. Seems like a oxymoron right?

AT

[Wei]

Hi RMX,

besides the plus points of having a sump mention by AT, it also increase yr redox( o2 level within the water)as the water flows down from the overflow. Plus, it also will eliminate some NH4. NH4 is very unstable, so when the water flow down mix with air, it will start to break into other harmless form. Thats why pple add an air pump into tank when their nh4 is high.

Wei

[RMX]

thanks for the replies. i think i have an idea why the sump/overflow is incorporated into the filteration system

[Tanzy]

Wei,

Redox aren't mentioned any more these days. I've never measured it before!

I don't think you can get rid of NH4+ by simple bubbling. It's oxidised by bacteria into nitrite. The bubbling is to provide surface aggitation to increase oxygen content of the water to facilitate the nitrification process.

[Wei]

Hi Tanzy,

yup, not much pple measurse redox. Its how much dissolved oxygen in the water. test kit couldn't give accurate value unless you use a probe. Pple start to forget abt this cos they have skimmer & overflow to mix the water with the air. If this value drops too low, it can affect yr fish & the amount of ca yr tank water can take.

its not aggitation that breaks down the nh4 but mixing water with air/O2. Even fish farm like Reefworld use this method when kenny first setup the fish holding tank before he add a skimmer. He also use this method when there is a spike in nh4. i, myself also use it when i temp move my livestocks into a 2ft uncycled while keeping nh4 at very low level. of corse, by increasing the oxygen level in tank also improves the nitrification.

Wei

[Tanzy]

Are you sure ammonium ions will react with free oxygen in water? Never heard of that before. Might be mythinformation.

[Wei]

Hi Tanzy,

yup be mythinfo. But as far as i know, this method works for not just me but others too.

Wei

[philip]

guys where is a good place to make sumps ..I plan to do one abt 3f lengthtx1ft heightx 15inch width ...any idea ?

[bawater]

RMX- for a 2ft its ok.But they are sensitive too!

For a 4ft, if u can afford- GO for a sump, u won't regret it.

If u can't(be it converting from FW or a free tnk or a really cheap tnk)then running 2 canisters for a 4ft would suffice for a good stable water platform.

i have one 4ft(previously an aro tnk)without sump- problems will arise on a regular basis,...change water weekly?

1 change equals to a 8gal pail(for me), i did start wif once every 14days...then it became every 21 days...then every 30days- now i stick to every 45-60 days.

Salt is not cheap & i can go thru a 8kg bag in a blink of an eye!it ain't worth it. - then i reuse the old water for other smaller tnks & then reused again for brine shrimp- too costly to throw after 1 use.

+ wif a sump u can hide all the equipment away. & i'm already planning for a next one.